Transcript

American Family Radio takes your Bible questions live on American Family Radio

>> Jeff Chamblee: The Bible. It's the word of God. Sharper than any two edged sword. This sacred book is living and active and contains all that's needed for life and godliness. Stay with American Family Radio for the next hour as we study God's word and take your Bible questions.

Exploring the Word is studying the Old Testament Book of Numbers

Welcome to Exploring the Word.

>> Alex McFarland: You know, one of the things that's very interesting about the Jewish people is they are meticulous record keepers. And in the Old Testament we see like in numbers 26 when they took a census, there are just names and family lineages and the record keeping is very accurate. And that's one of the reasons that of almost unparalleled with any other ethnicity in the world, the, the Israelites, the Jewish people, their, their family histories are very, very well preserved. Well, this is Exploring the Word and we're in the Book of Numbers. We're going to be in numbers 26 today. And Bert, this has been a fascinating study. you know, it, we're kind of getting towards the end. In fact, I would say probably by this time next week we'll be, completed with the Book of Numbers. And you know, when I was talking to you about, I don't know, six, seven weeks ago when we were talking about doing this book, Numbers is not a book that you hear taught from that much. And yet as you and I have gone through it, I've really enjoyed the rich content, a lot of gospel content from the Old Testament Book of Numbers.

>> Bert Harper: I've enjoyed it as well, Alex. And I've heard several people say, we've been amazed. And I said, well, it's like, you know, you go over everything, you know, it's kind of like being in a prairie, but all of a sudden a big giant comes up and then it goes back down. That's the way it is with numbers. Now all scripture is given the inspiration of God. But it's like chapter 26, okay, here you start out, you find out it says you've got to count all the males 20 years old and older to get ready to go to war. To do what? Go to war. That's what it says, be able to go to war. And then it starts listing them 12 tribes, gives you leaders from each tribe and then the final number. And so again, what do you get from that? Well, you get the importance of what God says. And every person, every tribe is important to the Lord. That's what you get from it spiritually. And you can see all these names. And God doesn't forget from whence they came. They all came from the sons of Jacob, that God said he would multiply. And then you come to the place where it gives you the total number in verse 51, and it gives you the total number of those men that they were to take and be ready for war. So, Alex. Yeah, but. And you come to the end of this, and there's some exciting things at the end of chapter, you know, chapter 26, when you see it. Now, I. I don't say it's exciting, but I would say it's really informative in reminding us of what, how God operates. So, again, that's the way the Book of Numbers is. It'll be kind of, you know, calm and going and. Okay, I see that. That's good. That's good. But then all of a sudden, out of that comes something, man, that really touches my heart. So that's the Book of Numbers.

>> Alex McFarland: Well, amen. And you know, as we said yesterday, that this, census was, instructed to them by God. Now, when David took his census, he got reprimanded because it was really kind of for vanity. But this was, ordered by God for one thing. They needed to know for safety's sake the men that could go to war. and that was part of it. And, you know, hey, I've got to, say there. There are a few surprising names in this. In Numbers 26, there, Verse 9, the sons of Eliab, Nemuel and Dathan. this is that day and Abiram, which were famous in the congregation, who strove against Moses and against Eryn in company of Korah when they strove against the Lord. Isn't that something that, It was grace, really. Even though they had had controversy with these, they still were listed in the census, weren't they?

>> Bert Harper: They were. And again, it shows God's importance of people and the record keeping of that which was good and bad.

The task is taking Jericho now again, counting them for war

Before we go any further, though, I do want to look at verse 3. Look where this is taking place. Across from Jericho.

>> Alex McFarland: Exactly.

>> Bert Harper: Now, Alex, something big is going to happen in Jericho. So when this numbering takes place, that is in view, I started thinking, you know, that's God usually operates that way, you know, and, he calls out his people at a certain time for a certain task. So here it is. The task is taking Jericho now again, counting them for war. You're going to find out obeying the Lord is important by marching around it. But the location was significant, I thought, when the census took place.

>> Alex McFarland: Amen. indeed. Well, the Lord knows the end from the Beginning. And he knows, that's why we don't have to worry necessarily what's around the corner, because God's already there, isn't he?

>> Bert Harper: Amen. Good word, brother.

>> Alex McFarland: Amen. over and over, you see in the word, in, numbers 26, the family, the family of the Jacobites, the family of the Shayulites. These are the families of The Simeonites. Verse 14, 2000 and 200. And Bert, for time, I'm not going to try to read all these verses. And also probably I would be guilty of a lot of accidental mispronunciations, but family and families, over and over. And by the way, family is still the cornerstone of society. And, and you know, I, I was on today's issues this morning, and we were talking about the, the declining birth rates, and sociologists are very concerned about the fact that family is not the priority that it ought to be. And so in the church it is. At least I hope it is. But, these families, I find it inspiring how many dozens and dozens of times in this one chapter is the affirmation of the family.

>> Bert Harper: It is. And no matter if they're large or small, we're going to get to that in a moment. And but each one of them is important and how they're to operate, they're going to have, remember, they're traveling in their positions around the, you know, the tent of meeting, the tabernacle. Each one of them has their location, where they're to meet. Now he's getting their names of how they will occupy, and they're getting ready also, just looking ahead. They're going to draw the boundaries and they're going to occupy their space in the land that God has promised them. So, yeah, I'm spiritualizing, Alex. Occupy your space. Well, you know, occupy your space. Well, God's given you a time frame. Now, I know you and I both love Andy Griffith and But hey, I was born for 2025 today. God's kept me around for this long. Not 1960, when the Andy Griffith show started, although I loved it and I can go back to it and yes, but God's called us for such a time as this in a location such as this. So the old generation. And again, you've gone over that. And if you want to go over back some names, you. But when you come to the end of it, you'll find out in verse 51, there was 600, 1,730 soldiers ready to go, quite a large army. And so he put Them all together added them up, but he knew each one and how many there were. This would be good because the. The reins of leadership is about to find out. It's going to be passed from Moses and we'll find out who to you most of you know already. But anyway, I could not get over again you go back if you want to go back over some of the names and tribes. But I could not help but verse 52, 56, how the land was divided. God would you say no partiality would that what you would say?

>> Alex McFarland: Amen, Exactly. and it says the land is divided by lot according to the names of the tribes of their fathers. They shall inherit and notice of all the. The ethnicities. Well, not ethnicities. They're all Jewish. But I mean all the different families. But the Levites are separate up through the end of verse 56. Or the. The families that are going to be, you know, delegated parcels of land.

>> Bert Harper: And.

>> Alex McFarland: And then really, the remainder of the chapter is about dealing with the Levites. and those that were numbered of them were 20 and 3000, all males from a month old and upward. But we've got. You know, yesterday we talked, right much about Phinehas, who was the son of Eleazar. But in verse 1661 unto Eryn was born Nadab and Abihu, Eliezer and Ithamar and Nadab and Abihu died when they offered strange fire before the Lord. And this is referenced in ah, Leviticus and also earlier in the Book of Numbers. Bert. a lot of speculation has been said about what that might have been, but it was unauthorized. Regardless of what the strange fire was, whatever they were doing in the tabernacle, and before the Lord, it was not by God's directive, was it?

>> Bert Harper: It was not. And that's the reason, obedience is important. Doing God's work God's way with a right heart attitude. So there's a lot of things when you obey the Lord, you take in consideration. Okay, I'm going to obey you whether now it's good to obey him. And it's better to obey him than not to obey him and get your heart ready right with him later. But the best way is immediate. Obey what God says now with the right attitude toward him. And so here they are. They're getting ready to go in the land. By the way, I'm just going to ask you, guess which tribe had the biggest number.

>> Alex McFarland: you tell us, Judah.

>> Bert Harper: You know, I couldn't help but notice this. You and me, okay? And People, this might help folks who look at the scripture and studying. And, I majored in math. So therefore, when I was going through chapter 26, man, I majored on those numbers. Look at that number. Look at that number. Alex, on the other hand, he's an English major. What did he tell you? He majored on the names, you know, and I'm big in geography, so I said, man, look where they are there. Jericho.

What you look at in the Bible can reveal a lot about yourself

So what? And I'm bringing. I've got purpose in this. Rather than just, you know, declaring something. Look at the gospels. Matthew, Mark, Luke and John. And when you read them, if you can take in consideration a few of the things, you'll see some of their interest, personalities coming out. Matthew's big on numbers. Now, I wonder what kind of occupation he had, you know. Tax collector.

>> Alex McFarland: Yes.

>> Bert Harper: Yeah.

>> Alex McFarland: And for the irs.

>> Bert Harper: And Luke, a physician. He gives more descriptions concerning physical ailments than any of the other mark, which was probably Peter helping him, you know, maybe writing it and Mark writing it down. But Peter had some, The key word is immediately. Doesn't that sound just like Peter? We got to get to this stuff. We got to go to there. So each personality. So when you study the Bible, you want to look at it all, but I'm just telling you what your interests are, your personality, it. It lets you know. Yes, the Holy Spirit helped you, but what you look at sometimes reveals something about yourself, Alex.

>> Alex McFarland: I know. And that's why, you know, the Bible is such a book for all people. I mean, really, no matter what your background is, no matter your personality type, or even, you know, what your strengths are, you will find something in the word of God if you read it. And so, let me. Let me read out this, final verses of, 26. these are they that were numbered by Moses and Eleazar, the priest who numbered the children of Israel in the plains of Moab by Jordan, again near Jericho. But among these, there was not a man of them whom Moses and Eryn the priest numbered when they numbered the children of Israel in the wilderness of Sinai. For the Lord said of them, they shall surely die in the wilderness.

>> Bert Harper: And.

>> Alex McFarland: And there was not left a man of them, save Caleb the son of Jephunneh, and Joshua the son of Nun. Remember the spies with the bad report, the negative report we were reading this back in? I believe it was numbers, chapter 14. they gave a bad report, and they didn't get to go toward the promised land, because they didn't really. They apparently didn't want it not badly enough to obey.

>> Bert Harper: That's exactly right. And we're not through with Joshua and Caleb, but especially Joshua in numbers. We're going to find him rising up again. Well, this is exploring the word. Stay with us as we continue in the book of Numbers.

Last year preborn helped to rescue over 67,000 babies from abortion

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>> Dr. Jessica Peck: There's a place for me I'm a.

>> Bert Harper: Child of God Yes I am. Brett Austin knows when to look at me with certain songs. He just knows that. Okay, that's one of Burt's songs. I love that song. And Praise God, he listen. He is for us. He's not against you. He has room for you. There's room at the cross for you who are listening today. If you've never received Jesus Christ as your savior, you're missing out on the greatest adventure that you could ever live. And I say that as truthfully as I can. And it's everything but boring. It's exciting because our God and I'm preaching on this Sunday night. He takes all things and works them into our lives for good. Now that's the word, the way it is. He works them into our lives. Usually, that one thing. Oh no. But when you work it in combine, it's amazing what our God does. Well, that was free. thank, you Brent. I made that for you while you were out sick. Okay, well listen, I, you know, I love that song.

Alex: Chapter 27 of the Bible affirms personhood for women

Alex, chapter 27. we got an interesting name and this is one of those very interesting chapters. Now you just read it, read it through it and you say oh, that's alright. But man, does this show you that every person is important to God and they talk about the Bible not caring about women. I just want to tell you, chapter 27 sure gives a different opinion even in the Old Testament, doesn't it?

>> Alex McFarland: well, it really does. It says, then came the daughters of Zelophe had, which, by the way, that word means firstborn son of he, for son of Gilead, son of Major, and it lists kind of some lineage there. they stood before Moses and before Eleazar the priest, before the princes and all the congregation by the door of the tabernacle of the congregation, saying, our father died in the wilderness, and he was not in the company of them that gathered themselves together against the Lord in the company of Korah, but who died, but died in his own sin and had no sons. Why should the name of our father be done away from among his family? Because he hath no son. Give unto us, therefore, a possession among the brethren of our Father. So I love the way verse five is, Moses brought their cause before the Lord. Now, Bert, let me ask you about verse three. they're pointing out the daughters of Zelophe had that their dad was not part of the rebellion of Korah. But it does say he died in his own sin. I think that means you feel free to disagree that just, he experienced his own mortality.

>> Bert Harper: I think that's it. I looked at that and I looked at that and I said, hey, that's all we is appointed unto. Man wants to die. Why, sin has passed upon all men.

>> Alex McFarland: Yeah, I think exactly so. So he was a sinner, as we all are, but he did not participate in the sin and the rebellion of Korah, and the earth swallowed those rebels up. But in other words, he. He experienced his own mortality. And I love verse 5. Moses brought their cause before the Lord, and the Lord spake unto Moses, saying, the daughters of Salofi had. Speak right. Thou shalt surely give them a possession of an inheritance among their father's brethren, and thou shalt cause the inheritance of their father to pass unto them. You're right. This is incredibly affirming of the rights of females. This was not misogynistic or patriarchal. the daughters here, they get the fair treatment that anyone else would have gotten.

>> Bert Harper: Amen. Another thing. He gives them their names. He just didn't say daughters. He gave their names. Now, there's one there that I don't know if I'd want it or not. Now, this is Bert Harper's. And that's it. Hogla. yeah. H O G L A H. I couldn't help but notice. hey, you're the one that notices the names. But I noticed that one. You can tell something about my temperament there. But anyway, he lists all the names of them. That's important. their possession is important. So who they are, Their names are important, Possessions are important. Their inheritance is important to God. I want to share that. That's not just true then. It is true now. And, so, Alex, I love what you said. What did Moses do? Moses said, you know, I hadn't covered that yet, so I'm going to bring that to the Lord. Where else would you bring it, man?

>> Alex McFarland: Yeah. And he prayed about it, and he sought the wisdom of the Lord. I know this is probably going to sound, obvious, but the naming of the daughters here affirms personhood.

>> Bert Harper: Yes, it does.

>> Alex McFarland: You know that they were not just nondescript, non entities. No, they were persons. And the God of the Bible, the Christian God, and obviously of Judaism here affirms personhood. Eastern religions like Hinduism and Buddhism say that you just dissolve into this cosmic pond of nothingness. No, persons matter to God, and for all of eternity, you will be the person that you are now. Hopefully, you become a born again, redeemed person. And the real you, the you that God intended, is the you that is in relationship with Jesus and growing in the conformity to Christ. And that's what, Bert, what a, what an irony that the world says, you know, do your thing, and, you know, that's where freedom and happiness is. Actually, if you try to do life and eternity your way, you're really going to miss out on the person that you could have been and frankly, should have been. But yet, if you surrender to God and his will, that's when you really get blessed and become what, some scholars have used the term a whole soul. In other words, sanctified and truly alive by the giver of life, the Lord Jesus.

>> Bert Harper: Amen.

Alex: What we describe here is a way of life that transcends difficulty

Alex, when you were speaking of that, I couldn't help but think about in the New Testament, they call it the way their followers, the way it is, the way he is, the way, the truth and the life. But the way, it's the way to real life, and it's the way to eternity, in heaven with Jesus. And so what we describe here is a way of life. Yes, and it transcends difficulty. Not to make you go through, above difficulty, but to go through the difficulty to go through the heartaches of life. And, so this is so important, and it's not through yet with this he gives them. He says they have spoken right. What is right? And you shall speak to the children of Israel, say in verse eight, if a man dies and has no son, then you shall cause his inheritance to pass to his daughter. Now it is not through. If he has no daughter, then you shall give his inheritance to his brothers. If he has no brothers, then you shall give his inheritance to his father's brothers. And if his father has no brothers, then you shall give their inheritance. Now listen to this. To the kinsman nearest him in his family. There's an important word there, Alex. Kinsman.

>> Alex McFarland: You and I have talked about that quite a bit, and we get this question sometimes about what is the kinsman redeemer and the kinsman redeemer. It's seven times in the Book of Ruth that's mentioned. But it's a picture of Jesus and the salvation because he is incarnate. He is our near kinsman and was able to be the payment for our sins. But the. The kinsman next to him shall get the inheritance. Okay, so to get the inheritance of land, you had to be a family member. To get the inheritance of heaven, you've got to be a family member.

>> Bert Harper: Preach it.

>> Alex McFarland: That is the family of God.

>> Bert Harper: Amen.

Alex Merce: God prefigured Moses' death in Exodus chapter 27

Well, we come to verse 12, and it says, now, the Lord said to Moses, go up into the mount, Abraham, and see the land which I have given to the children of Israel. Now, in a way, this is beautiful, but also sad. You're going to get to see it. You're close enough to look over the river and see it, but you're not going to go in now, they've heard me say, well, he does get to go in at the transfiguration, but he's not physically able to go in now. And when you have seen it, you also shall be gathered to your people as Eryn, your brother, was gathered. For. For in the wilderness end, during the strife of the congregation, you rebelled against my command to hallow me at the waters before their eyes. And that's what took place. So here it is, God remembering in chapter 26 that Caleb and Joshua, they brought back a good report. God remembered it 40 years later. And here in chapter 27, an act of rebellion and disobedience that happened quite a few years later, but it happened years later. God remembered that as well, didn't he, Alex?

>> Alex McFarland: He really did. He really did. And, you know, it's, the death of Moses prefigured here. it's kind of pictorial. It says that the Lord told Moses that you're going to be, quote, gathered unto thy people. And, you know, Bert does not speak of the reunion in heaven. That, listen, I hope to everybody listening, I hope that you come from a long line of believers and that you, too, are a Believer. And there's an old song. I know this song has been played so much that it's almost become like, I'm not going to say a cliche, but the song Will the Circle Be Unbroken?

>> Bert Harper: Yeah.

>> Alex McFarland: By and by. And that song, that is such a tender sentiment, hopefully. And it's really a prayer that the family circle will be complete, that everybody will be in heaven, and make that your family's goal. They're gathered unto thy people, in other words, in heaven with God one day.

>> Bert Harper: Alex, can I share a personal story real quick, please? At my mom and dad's, they were married for 62 years before, my mom died. But on their 60th anniversary, we were all gathered at my brother's house to celebrate my mom and dad's 60th wedding anniversary. I'm the youngest of nine. We were all there a lot of the grant. I mean, we had a large group there. And it came time close to the end, and my dad spoke up, and he said, I've got one request, and I'll never forget it. He said, I want you to all be there in heaven with me. And said, I know. He talked about when he received Christ as a boy and how Christ had changed his life. And he said, there's nothing better. I want all of you to be there with me, man. That's, implanted in my brain and my mind. And my mother, which would not be making speeches, she'd rather talk one on one. She'd say, well, I'm going to be right there with you, Merce. And so having that circle unbroken, pray for it continue and don't give up on those that have heard the truth. And maybe they haven't come to that yet. the story's not over with yet, so keep praying.

>> Alex McFarland: Amen. Amen.

Bert Miller: Biblical chapter 27 talks about leadership being delegated to Joshua

well, the chapter closes out, chapter 27 about the mantle of leadership, being delegated to Joshua, verse 15. And Moses spake unto the Lord, saying, let the Lord, the God of the spirits of all flesh, set a man over the congregation, which go out before them and may go in before them and may lead them out, and which may bring them in, that the congregation of the Lord be not as sheep which have no shepherd. You know, the Bible says Jesus had compassion on the multitudes because they were like sheep without a shepherd. this is just very precious and very good leadership. A succession plan. Bert, let me, I know Tom Fleets way. I just want to say this. I've been around a lot of ministries and churches where there really Wasn't a succession plan in place. And I honestly think the greatest leaders, first of all, because none of us are going to live forever. And really, leadership is something the Lord graciously allows us to participate in. For a while, I've known men, godly men, and they just could not let go. And then they die. And the people left behind are scrambling to, you know, put the pieces back together. I think it's wise leadership, very mature leadership. not to hasten on, you know, the end of your time, but to have a succession plan because it's God's work, not our own work. And Moses is willing to do that. And he prays about this. And of course, in verse 18, God is going to say it's Joshua, the son of nun. But a succession plan is just wise, responsible, foresight, isn't it?

>> Bert Harper: It really is. And I use another illustration that's here at AFA with our founder, Don Wildmon. I was on the board when, you know, we can see his health. And, the board met without him. We talked about, what is the plan? And, Don. And it was Tim. And he was ready to receive it. He had received some responsibilities along the way. And that's exactly what there's going to do with Moses. he's going to give him some of the responsibility, Joshua. Not all of it at one time, but give him some of those. And so having that plan, the other thing I'd like to say, verse 16, a man over God does want leadership. God wants a head. You know, follow me. it's hard to follow when you got 10 guys at the head. So you follow that one. And again, we're not talking about a dictatorship, but we're talking about leadership here. And so, yes, Alex, it was so good. And Joshua is the man. And, notice it says to him, a man who is the spirit. The spirit is in him. Lay your hand on him. Set him before Eleazar the priest and before all the congregation, and commission him in their sight. Now, Alex, notice what it says, and then I'll turn it back over to you because we ain't got a lot of time. We do want to finish this. And you shall give some of your authority to him. That's, you know, that's. That's preparing it, isn't it?

>> Alex McFarland: it's really incremental delegation, more and more. And, you know, I thought it was such a beautiful thing, like with the Billy Graham ministry, as Franklin Graham stepped into those shoes, you know, and eventually, you know, their ministering didn't skip a beat. Even though when a beloved leader like a Billy Graham or a Don Wildmon passes on, of course there's, you know, acknowledgement and even grieving. But, it's just good stewardship. And I've seen a fair amount of ministries where maybe a founder or a powerful leader just couldn't, couldn't let go. But it's just wise. This is now common in the business world that the person emerges who's got the leadership and you increasingly, you know, delegate things to them. But I also wanted to point out a word there. in verse 19, it says, Give him a charge or a commissioning. There's something about a public acknowledgment of leadership being transferred, isn't it?

>> Bert Harper: It is. And he did that in 23. And he laid his hands on him and inaugurated him, just as the Lord commanded by the hand of Moses. God's will done God's way. That's the way you want to go. Well, we're going to take phone calls. That number 888 580. Give us that call. And that Bible question today.

Are you a new small group leader looking for a strong curriculum

>> Jeff Chamblee: Are you a new small group leader looking for a strong curriculum? Even if you've been a leader for years, there's always a need for tools to help you as you help others deepen their love for God and their Bible knowledge. AFA Stream is a great resource with topics covering biblical worldview, training, godly marriage and more. You'll have access to some of the best teaching available. And if you're a great commission partner, you open up even more. Visit stream.aca.net today. Stream.aca.net for he has rescued us from the dominion of darkness and brought us into the kingdom of the Son he.

>> Alex McFarland: Loves Colossians 1 13.

>> Jeff Chamblee: American Family Radio.

>> Dr. Jessica Peck: I got stolen by the grave robber Pick me up from that rock bott Wash my soul in that holy water brought me back to life One more song flowed away One more sinner been saved by grace this dead man, he ain't dead no longer all because of that grave robber.

Alex will speak at the Cedar Falls Bible Conference next month

>> Alex McFarland: Welcome back to Exploring the Word. Alex and Bert. We're going to go to calls and Bible questions and just maybe hold your place. And we'll pick up more of numbers, on Monday because tomorrow's fire away Friday. But the number, if you've got a Bible question, it's triple 858-98-9840. That's triple 858-9840. Hey Bert, I gotta, give a little heads up to people in Iowa. I have the great Great privilege of speaking in a couple of weeks at the Cedar Falls Bible Conference. And guess what? This coming up, which is July 26th through August 2nd. And I'll be there on the final day. it's the 104th annual Cedar Falls Bible Conference. It's just one of the greatest gatherings in, in America that over a century ago, the, the city fathers, you know, Cedar Falls, Iowa, they wanted this annual summer Bible conference. And so I would love to see a lot of people there. I'll be there on August 2nd. But I just want to say I am so honored that I've been invited to speak at that wonderful, that institution, the Cedar Falls Bible Conference.

>> Bert Harper: Amen, Alex. And we'll be praying for you. I want to implore you. As Alex travels, speaks around. It's not easy to do what he does. Picking up, packing, traveling. Now he's calling. but listen, just pray for him safety, encouragement, you know, and it's great, isn't it great, to go back to someplace where you know how they are and how the spirit of the Lord's been there before. It's like, okay, yeah, I know. And so we're going to be praying for that.

>> Alex McFarland: Alex, thank you. I've been so blessed. Oh, my goodness, the people of America, all 50 states, they're so good to me that they would invite me and then invite me back many, many times. I'm very blessed.

>> Bert Harper: We're blessed to have you on exploring the Word. Thank you. And all your travels. You take time to do this.

Bill had a question about Roman Catholicism and doctrine on salvation

Let's go to Ohio, and it's Bill. Bill, thank you for calling today.

>> Caroline: Thanks for having me.

>> Bert Harper: How are y' all doing? Well, go right ahead. Brother.

>> Caroline: Had a quick question about, Roman Catholicism and teaching, on, doctrine on salvation, how one is made right with God or justified before God. if. Does that place Roman Catholics, outside of, orthodox, ah, Christian views, and if so, are people who sit under that teaching and agree with the doctrine. Are they. Are they, true believers?

>> Bert Harper: Okay. Yeah. Bill, thank you for your call.

There are those that are truly born again and those that aren't

Alex, let's. Let's make this statement first. And I'll make it, I'm gonna make two things. It's gonna be, you know, Catholics and their doctrine that we have some differences and even, I would say use the word issues concerning it. I guess there is from our biblical and what the scripture says. But I've. I've met several Catholic, brothers and sisters in Christ that know Jesus Christ as savior. some of them have come out of the Catholic Church to be a part of an evangelical church. I know some who have stayed and said, we are doing our work here. God saved us. But we're getting into the Word. We're going to take others into the Word so they can know Jesus as Savior. And are these lots saved? Yeah, there's some saved, but there's a lot not saved. But I could say this also. Just because you're an evangelical doesn't mean you're automatically born again man, does it?

>> Alex McFarland: No. No, it doesn't. And, you know, I, I want to be as clear as I can on this. in any traditionally Christian denomination, whether it be the big Protestant denominations, Baptist, Methodist, Presbyterian, assembly, of God, or in the Catholic Church or the Greek Orthodox Church for that matter, there are those that are truly born again and those that, that aren't. And don't get me wrong, I'm a Protestant. but I've read a lot of the official Catholic, writings and believe it or not, they really do. And in fact, I'm going to read one of the official, Catholic websites right here. let me read what they say. the saving grace won by Jesus on the cross is offered as a free gift to us, accessible through repentance. Faith and baptism is what they say. We turn away from our sins, we are sorry for them, and we believe in Jesus Christ and the Gospel. Repentance shows a willingness to turn from sin. And it says, baptism renews us. Now, I hope they're meaning that by faith we're baptized into Christ. Water baptism is not what saves. and it says, we're not teaching salvation by works. the idea has consistently been condemned. Good works are required because God requires obedience. But even our obedience is impossible without faith in Christ. So, I mean, yeah, it's good. And First John 5:1 says, Whoever believes that Jesus is the Christ is born of God. I will say this, for those that get born again in the Roman Catholic system, it's the grace of really the grace of God because there's so much religiosity and formality. There are those that find salvation through simple faith in Christ. But it's pretty miraculous given all of the religious language and machinations that go, that accompany that.

>> Bert Harper: One of my dearest friends, his name is M. Mike, Brzezinski. I'll call out his name. He wrote a book, Taming of the Wild Heart. It's one of the best books I've read. He was a falconer, and he talked about how it is, anyway, relationship's amazing. Just a great, great book. He is Catholic and he said he, knows some folks that got saved. they look into the meaning of the rituals. You know, that's his words. And, so if you're Catholic and you're listening, today, we thank God you're listening. We're not trying to harm you in any way, but we're saying make sure you have this relationship with Jesus Christ. It's not just part of quote. I'm, part of the church. No, I'm a part of the body of Christ, which is a relationship by grace through faith. And that's what we want. That number, and we do have lines that are open. Is 888-589-8840. Triple 858-98840.

Debbie thanks everyone for praying for her daughter and son-in-law

Give us a question. We'd love to have it today while we're waiting for others. Let's go to California. Debbie, thank you for calling. Debbie, are you there? Yeah, go right ahead.

>> Caroline: Can you hear me?

>> Bert Harper: Yes, ma', am.

>> Caroline: I have a Hands in the air. Praise hallelujah for everyone that was praying for my daughter Ashley, and my son in law Miguel. The trek that they made across the country and back and they made it home safely. Amen. I know that that was all of everyone's prayers and I, I want to thank you and, you, Alex and Bert and just for all of the prayers, I'm so thankful and I know that's what got them safely to California and safely back to Florida. But, thank you. That's. That was the purpose of my call. And I, I did want to say something about Alex's little dog Esther. every time you've mentioned her, my grandmother's name was Esther and she was such a godly lady. And I, know your little est must be such a sweetheart.

>> Alex McFarland: Oh, you are so kind. You were so kind. Hey, did we send you a book? Because I want to do that. a lot of times I don't do it every time, but when people reference my beloved little dog, if I haven't sent you a book already, then please give Brent Austin your address and I'll put in the mail one of our hundred questions books.

>> Caroline: Oh, that would be such a blessing to me. No, I haven't received one.

>> Alex McFarland: Please give Brent Austin your address. And, I do remember praying for that trip across the country. We really did. and you know, all those thousands of miles, we prayed for them.

>> Bert Harper: And thank you for calling us back as a praise. I, I think that's where A lot of us miss it. We. We pray and, we don't follow it with the praise, and we want to do that. And so. We got someone on the line. Yeah, it's Gary from Texas. Gary, thank you for calling. Yes, I would like to know if.

>> Jeff Chamblee: Satan is going to feel pain in.

>> Bert Harper: In the lake of fire. Ha ha ha. Okay. I don't see why not. Okay, now again, we know that he was an archangel. And, from everything I seen with Gabriel and Michael, Alex, when their description there seems to be, you know, that physical yet spiritual. I don't know exactly how that is. It's, There's another mystery, you would say. But I got a feeling he's going to receive. I can't imagine no pain. What about you?

>> Alex McFarland: Well, Revelation 14:11, speaking of the lake of fire, and it says, the smoke of their torment ascends forever and ever. And I looked up the Word and, the word is really torture or agony. And not only Satan and the demons, but the. The lost masses that rejected, Jesus. Yeah, they're the lake of fire. It's going to be pain. Not only, I think, well, physical pain, the pain of the soul, but even the psychological pain. You know, the unsaved people that heard the gospel and rejected Jesus, but those angels that were in the very presence of God and rebelled, and the knowledge. Bert, it's been said that the door.

>> Bert Harper: Okay, Alex is in Myrtle beach. And some, way that connection went, blank. Real quick, Brent will try to get Alex back on, and we will answer that. But we do thank the Lord for praise. And the thing about Satan, he is a. He's. He is a defeated foe. Praise God. In the future, he'll be a vanquished foe. And, that is awesome to remember. But our victory is in Jesus Christ, in Christ alone. We got this call in and, Brent gave it to me. We connected with Alex yet? Hey, brother. Okay, good.

>> Alex McFarland: Sorry about that. Don't know what happens.

>> Bert Harper: Hey, it happens when you're on the road like you are. Every so often. It keeps us praying, for you. But we got this, that came in at email for us. It says this. In the New Testament, tithing is not mentioned anywhere. Well, that's not necessarily true. Let me just share that. But why people are so preaching about, even stops non believers from exploring. Once a non believer asked me, is it mandatory to pay 10% to church? How can we gently talk about this non believer if they ask such questions? Go ahead, Alex.

>> Alex McFarland: Well, you know, Paul, talked about giving on the first day of the week, you know, purpose in your heart and give not grudgingly. And then Paul told them to take a collection, so there didn't have to be one when I come. So I would, I would say, financial stewardship and giving and supporting the work of the gospel. and, you know, let me just say it's been said that a Christian under grace should at least do as much as a Jew under the law. And the law it was 10%. So we speak of tithes and offerings.

Jesus is talking about tithing now in the New Testament church

And that was very prominent in the New Testament church, wasn't it?

>> Bert Harper: It really was. And they talked about tithing of mint and coming. And Jesus said these things you should have done, but not left the others undone. So Jesus is talking about tithing now. How do you talk to it? About an unbeliever. Listen, I wouldn't be afraid to answer the question straight on and say, listen. And I would answer it basically the way you just answered it, Alex. And, I would say, but that's not the important issue. The important issue is your heart. It's your life. listen, when you give Christ your life, you're opening up everything. And, I said, and I couldn't help but go ahead and go, listen, God. God's a blesser. That doesn't mean everything. But I want to tell you, the amount of money you keep. God will bless if you are faithful and giving. again, yes, it is much.

>> Alex McFarland: Better to have the 90% with God's blessing than to have 100% and be in a state of disobedience.

>> Bert Harper: That would be the answer.

Philip from Tennessee asks Alex Scripture to help fight abortion

Well, we got time for one more question. His question was about Adam resting on the seventh day. Well, God rested on the seventh day. Do you think Adam took that up, Alex?

>> Alex McFarland: well, you know, God later would give the. The Sabbath. I think probably Adam and Eve there, in the presence of God, they were, instructed in the principle of taking a day of rest. but the Bible doesn't specifically say, does it?

>> Bert Harper: It does not. And, so we don't know. Okay, let's go. Philip from Tennessee. what's that help to fight abortion? We're not. We're going to take Alex Scripture to help fight abortion. You got any off the top of your head?

>> Alex McFarland: Well, Psalm 139, for one that, you know, talks about, we are fearfully and wonderfully made. clearly personhood begins at the moment of conception. And in fact, really, as God told Jeremiah, you know, he. God knew us before we were even conceived, in our mother's womb.

>> Bert Harper: Philip, we hope that helps. Again, the Bible is filled with that. And, listen, when we look at how we're fearfully and wonderfully made in mother's womb, it's an amazing thing. Well, Alex, it's been good to be with you today. I thank God for you, brother. And I pray things will go good there in Mercury, Myrtle Beach.

>> Alex McFarland: Well, thank you very much. We're working on our big, August 21st event with Charlie Kirk. If you want to hear Charlie Kirk in person. And there'll be a lot of Q and A that night, too, go to alexmcfarland.com conversations in the meantime, tell somebody about the great programming of the American Family Radio Network. But most importantly, tell everybody about Jesus. The views and opinions expressed in this broadcast may not necessarily reflect those of.

>> Jeff Chamblee: The American Family association or American Family Radio.