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>> Bert Harper: The Bible. It's the word of God. Sharper than any two edged sword. This sacred book is living and active and contains all that's needed for life and godliness. Stay with American Family Radio for the next hour as we study God's word and take your Bible questions.
Exploring the Word with Bert Harper and Dylan Burroughs
Welcome to Exploring the Word. We could ask a question. Are you walking in the vanity of your mind? Well, the apostle Paul says those who are without Jesus Christ, they're not thinking fully. Vanity, empty. And so today the apostle Paul, after he's instructed them to be one in the spirit, to have this oneness of unity and carry out their position, he says now let's talk about this. How should you respond and react? This is Bert Harper along with Dylan Burris. And Dylan, it's good to have you brother.
>>dillon: Great to be back. Yeah, we miss Alex, but he's doing some great work in Montana this week, working with the group of young people in a camp and so continue praying for him as he travels back.
Dillon Burroughs joins us to discuss Ephesians chapter 4
But today glad to join you once again as we go through a portion of Ephesians chapter 4, one of my favorite chapters in the Bible. Thanks for having me back.
>> Bert Harper: You bet, brother. And we, we said yesterday with Alex's travels, sometimes he doesn't quite make it in time. And so we talked to him earlier and we, we decided, okay Alex, we'll take care of it. And so Dylan, thank you for being with us. And yes, chapter four. Now let's set this up. Chapters one, two and three are the richness. I would to keep it with alliterated. it's the wealth that we have in Christ. And now in chapters four, five and six, it's the walk we should have following that wealth. And so Paul is laid it out in verse 17. Notice he uses the word therefore matter of fact. I think it's seven times in the last three chapters, Dylan, that Paul uses therefore, in other words, based on what I've God's given you, based on what you have in Christ. This should follow. So here's verse 17 and following a little bit this, I say therefore and testify in the Lord that you should no longer walk as the rest of the Gentiles walk in the futility of their mind or the vanity emptiness of their mind, having their understanding darkened, being alienated from the life of God because of the ignorance that is in them, because of the hardening of their heart, who being past feeling have given themselves over to la to work uncleanness with greediness. But you have not so learned Christ. Now I'M stopping there. You could go on. But each one of these that he's talking about, Dylan, has to do with your thinking. You know, if you don't get your thinking straight, you're not going to walk straight, are you?
>> Alex McFarland: Well, you're right. And our thoughts always influence our actions. And this passage is very clear about that one word that stands out to me in verse 18, especially that phrase being alienated from the life of God. You know, we've seen a lot in the news lately about UFOs and aliens and all the speculation, but that word being alienated is this idea of being separated, being different, being foreign. That when we are separated from God, we are in contrast with his plan, in contrast with his will. And talks about that because of the ignorance that is in them and the blindness of their heart. this is the contrast of the way of God. So we see the contrast of the old man, the new man, the old person, the new person, a new way of life in Christ. And Paul sets that up in a strong contrast. that just reminds me of how important it is to remember the new life that we have in the Lord and the calling that we have to live a life worthy of him instead of sliding back into our old ways and into our old habits. It's such a powerful passage.
>> Bert Harper: It really is. And notice in verse 17 the rest of the Gentiles, the other Gentiles. In other words, this means the church at Ephesus is mainly made up of gentiles. Yes, there are some Jewish believers who are there because there was a synagogue there, there in Ephesus and Paul would go to it, but the believers, those gentiles had responded. And he, he, I think it has two things, if you're not careful, you will always go back to the familiar. yes, I, I think, I don't believe anybody could ever say that's not true. The familiar is usually comfortable, even, even when it was difficult and hard. And he said, and so don't go back to the familiar. Do not walk after. Let me say this and I want you to respond after your former heroes. Now what I mean, you know, I grew up when the NewSong York Yankees were awesome, I just tell you, Mickey Mantle, Roger Maris, so many. And there was a godly man in that bunch. And some of you that are older remember Bobby Richardson. But you know, some of my heroes were not as godly as they should have been. They weren't walking. But these were my heroes. After I was saved as a 12 year old boy, I started Recognizing a little bit of difference in that, Dylan. And I said, okay, what kind of people do I want to emulate? What kind of people do I want to follow? And it changed my perspective. And so one of the things that there's adults and young people listening when what you want to look at don't walk as the rest of the world walks. Don't make your heroes, these people that you would emulate with your life, unless they're following Christ. What. What do you think about that?
>> Alex McFarland: Well, it's true. And it reminds me so much of that cultural lie that we have that what I'm doing doesn't bother anybody else. You know, I can do my own thing and nobody else is impacted by it. Well, that is certainly not true. Others are always watching, especially young eyes. If you have children or grandchildren or even people in your influence, at your church or other places, everything you do is watched by others, and it's certainly seen by God as well. So we're called to do what is right in the eyes of the Lord. Not just when people are watching, but at all times. That's what our character is all about. And when we do that, it shows that, we are consistent in the new life that we've been given, like this passage talks about. So it's not one of those things where we can act like it's not mattering to other people. It's essential to the impact that we have on others and our calling to make disciples of all nations as we seek to live for the Lord.
>> Bert Harper: One more thing I want to say before we go on, and that is the hardening of their hearts. This seems to be a progressively downward spiral when you have wrong thinking. you know, it says the futility of their mind, their empty thinking. They're not thinking it through, they're not thinking eternally. These that are lost, we need to think eternal with eternality in mind. But here, because of that, their, their ignorance grows to the. And it continues on to the hardening. That's why, when God speaks to your heart, you need to say, yes, Lord, yes. Not no, not now. We need to say yes to him, don't we, Dylan?
>> Alex McFarland: We do. And just like the prophet Isaiah, here am I, Lord, send me. That's the response that we should have today. And this passage, verses 17 and 19 end with the word greediness. and ultimately all these practices that you're talking about, focus on this idea of greediness or selfishness and what we try to get out of life versus living for the Lord. So when we flip that and we become a person who is serving others and serving our God, it will show the new life that we have in the Lord, which will talk about in these upcoming verses.
>> Bert Harper: Verse 20.
Alex McFarlane: There's a difference between learning Christ and learning about Christ
I want to spend a little bit of time here. Yes, you have not so learned Christ. Now, in a way that's a little bit twist. It doesn't say, Let me say this is an Alex McFarlane M. He does this quite often. He says, let us look at what it doesn't say. and so I just want to do one thing. It does not say, but you have not so learned about Christ. There's a difference in learning Christ and learning about Christ. I heard this illustration, and I pass it on. I've heard it many times by many people. Okay, I'll use Winston Churchill. I could read about Winston Churchill. I could read about autobiographies. I could listen to his speech. So I could learn about Winston Churchill. But because he's already. And I vested his, grave site there in England one time years and years ago. And I learned a lot there, but learned a lot about him. I didn't learn him, but Jesus Christ. You can learn him because he's alive, can't you?
>> Alex McFarland: Yes. And it's a little clear in modern translations like the NIV that says it's not the way of life. You learned when you heard about Christ. I, think that's, an easier understanding of the passage and how it's translated. that's not how it was when we heard about the message of Christ. It says instead, if indeed you have heard him and have been taught by him, as the truth is in Jesus. Verse 22 says that you put off concerning your former conduct, the old man, which grows corrupt according to the deceitful lusts. And then verse 23 is the contrast. And be renewed in the spirit of your mind. that phrase we see in Romans 12 as well, this being transformed by the renewing of your mind. We see it again here in Ephesians 4 and following verse that you put on the new man, which was created according to God in true righteousness and holiness. It's all not negative, not doom and gloom. It's a contrast between what we're putting off and what we're putting on in God, which is true righteousness and holiness as we focus on the change that God has done in our hearts.
>> Bert Harper: This is really one of, I would say Paul's theme in Romans, even in the first chapter, about how degraded man can become, you know, reprobate. It's also in Colossians when it talks about putting on the new man. So this is one of the themes that Paul really associates, with. And most of the time it is to a major, When he does do this to a major Gentile church. And again, the reason is they've come out of this lifestyle that was described here as ignorant, darkened, blind, you know, and now they've come into life and light. Okay, they've come into it. But again, that familiar is still there. And so he says these things you should put off, that a man grows, old man which grows corrupt. There's that that I was referring to earlier when I said the hardening of their heart. It was degrading in downward spiral. Here he affirms that in verse 22 by saying, the old man grows corrupt according to the deceitful L. In other words, have you ever heard. No, Christian, if you're not going forward, you're drifting backward. Have you heard that, Dylan?
>> Alex McFarland: Yes, of course.
>> Bert Harper: So, honestly, the corrupt man, the deceived man, the same thing is that he's drifting away from truth. Once you're exposed to truth and you do not respond to that truth, you drift away from that truth by the deceitfulness of your mind. That's. That's why the Bible says today is the day of salvation, isn't it?
>> Alex McFarland: Yes. And I want to encourage people, though this isn't something we do in our own strength. The Transition in verse 25 gives us the source of our strength. We are given a quote from God's Word from the Old Testament, and we are given a focus on the Holy Spirit of God. So it is God's Word in us, God's Spirit in us, that makes this difference, not our own strength. So if you look at verse 25, it starts off, therefore, putting away lying. Let each one of you speak truth with his neighbor, which is a quote from Zechariah 8. For we are all members of one another. says in verse 26, be angry and do not sin, and do not let the sun go down on your wrath, nor give place to the devil. These are all quotes from the Old Testament, but also a focus on the Spirit of God, as we will see coming up, about not grieving the Spirit and putting our trust in his power to change our lives and give us the strength to change rather than our own strength.
>> Bert Harper: Notice what you said, one another. It goes back to what chapter four began with, the unity. We're not uniform, but we're unified in Christ Jesus to be the people God's called us to be as followers of Christ. Well, we're going to continue in Ephesians chapter 4 When we come back. But I'm telling you in the, in the third segment, we're going to have a special phone call from someone to give us an update. You don't want to go away. Stay tuned for more here on Exploring the Word. If we've learned anything from this election, it's how important it is for us to fight, fight, fight. We also learned how desperately the left wants to fight to take babies lives, which is why every day preborn Ministries fights for the babies. PreBorn's network of clinics are positioned in the highest abortion areas, fighting for mothers deciding between the life and death of their child. Preborn welcomes these women with God's love and offers them a free ultrasound to introduce their precious baby and hear the beautiful heartbeat. This amazing encounter gives her baby a fighting chance and the majority of the time she'll choose life. Would you join PreBorn in the fight for life? One ultrasound is just $28 and $140 will sponsor five ultrasounds. Babies are worth fighting for. To donate, dial pound 250 on your cell and say the key word baby. That's £250 baby. Or visit preborn.com afr that's preborn.com afr all gifts are tax deductible and PreBorn has four star charity ratings.
We can praise the Lord for his word, for all of his benefit benefits
Fight, fight, fight for the babies.
>> Alex McFarland: Praise him for friends and family, for the very air we breathe, for having everything we need. Won't somebody come praise the Lord with me?
>> Bert Harper: Well, that's what we want to do on exploring the Word. We want to praise the Lord. We can praise the Lord for his word, for all of his benefit benefits. You read Psalm 103 and you go down that list and look at all those benefits of following Christ. I don't see why anybody would turn away from knowing him well.
Our guest host today who has become a regular host is Dylan Burroughs
Our guest host today who has become a regular host with us is Dylan Burroughs. Alex is, is flying and he's probably in the air right now, getting close to ready to land there in Greensboro, North Carolina. He's been in North Carolina, in Montana, and he's going to give a report tomorrow about what God has done. He gave me a little sense of it, but I told him leave some of it out because I want to rejoice with our, listeners to hear all that God has done. So you want to tune in tomorrow to hear the report of the first youth camp this summer there that Alex hosted in Montana. Well, Dylan, we're in chapter four again. Notice it says put off and put on, put away and bring in. Now, I heard this illustration. I wished I knew where I read it. I wished I knew who I could give credit for. But I just want to use it. It's not original with me. this is before emails and texting and so forth, is when people had to write letters. Do y' all remember? Do you remember those things, Dylan?
>> Alex McFarland: Yes.
>> Bert Harper: Okay, vaguely.
>> Alex McFarland: Back in the day.
>> Bert Harper: Back in the day. Well, there was this man who had started a company, and it was very successful, but he had given himself to it so much, and he and his wife was going to take a cruise around the world, be a year gone. But he said, listen, I'm leaving it in charge. Left some guys in charge. And he said, I am going to write you and I'm going to share with you the procedures and expectations while I'm gone so you can continue doing the work and doing your jobs. So he did that each every month at least, and sometimes twice a month, gave those instructions, gave what they needed. And then he returned a year later. When he got to the company, he noticed the lawn was unkept, the shrub was uncut, and the windows were just. All one or two was broken out. So he goes in and he says, what have you done? did you not receive my instructions and my letters? And the boss said, oh, yes, we received them. We were so glad we got every one of them. We've even posted them so people could come by and read them. And they said they were so impressive that some people even memorized parts of your letters, and others came and memorized a whole letter that you had written. And we even had studies concerning what your letters were saying. And the owner, the guy said, here, why didn't you obey them? You know, God has left us a lot of letters from the word of God. Ephesians is one of them. Did he write it so we could just study it and say, oh, isn't that great how Paul said that? Isn't that great that he included the Old Testament right here at this place? Is that the reason he wrote it so we would be impressed by the letters? Or was there, some instructions we're supposed to follow? Dylan?
>> Alex McFarland: Yeah, reminds me of James 1, where it talks about, you know, do not merely listen to the Word and so deceive yourselves. Do what it says. It's a great illustration of that. And, that's what we've been talking about Here in Ephesians 4, this focus on God's words, the strength to do what is right and to live according to the new ways that we are called to in Jesus Christ. And then this focus on the Holy Spirit to empower us to do what is right. there are so many good quotes about the Holy Spirit, but one of my favorites is from Corrie 10 boom, who's a well known Christian leader from the past century. She wrote that trying to do the Lord's work in your own strength is the most confusing, exhausting and tedious of all work. But when you are filled with the Holy Spirit, then the ministry of Jesus flows out of you. And I love that idea that in God's power we can do what God has called us to do, but in our own strength it's a failure, it's tedious, work, it's exhausting and we're just not able to do it. So there's a difference in perspective that leads to a difference in outcome. And that's what the Apostle Paul focuses on here.
Let the Holy Spirit use you. Just as you well said in Corrie 10 boom
As we continue in these verses, let
>> Bert Harper: me give you a little bit of my wife Jan and what she agrees with Corrie 10 boom. she said, bert, I've heard you preach and I've heard the Holy Spirit use you. Let the Holy Spirit use you. And I say that truthfully, Dylan, that is so real. The difference is something we can be impressed with certain things. But the Holy Spirit, His Spirit bears witness with our spirit, that we're the children of God and also the Spirit of the Lord working in us and through us. And that same Holy Spirit that's working in the preacher, the teacher, the, the server, whatever it is, that same Holy Spirit is working on the people who are listening and learning, the people who are receiving the service. So it is compounded and that's the reason it's so important. Just as you well said in Corrie 10 boom said how important the Holy Spirit is. One more thing. Just this list is amazing. We're not going to take time to go over it individually. Although if you're doing a Bible study of Ephesians, I would suggest it. Notice what he does here about putting off the anger. Okay. he says stealing. Don't steal any longer. Work with your own hands. Do not let, corrupt communication proceed out of your mouth. Listen, he gets very practical here, doesn't he, Dylan? He's calling out these sins, isn't he?
>> Alex McFarland: Yes. And this particular part is one area that stood out to me. I remember being a senior in high school and all my friends, we used to Trash talk each other all the time, whether it was on the basketball court or in the classroom. And as I started growing in my walk with God and reading the scriptures, I saw this verse about no corrupt word proceeding out of your mouth, but what is good for necessary edification. And I thought, well, that means I probably shouldn't be trash talking all of my friends. Right? but that's a hard habit to break because that's kind of a cultural norm, that we speak down to each other, that we're sarcastic all the time. But if you stand up and change that and flip the script and encourage people around you, you suddenly start to see God work through you in a different way. And you stand out by God's spirit working through you through this edification process. And it's, a very spiritual thing. I noticed the difference very quickly, and it's been a big part of my life ever since.
>> Bert Harper: It does. He, the Holy Spirit makes the difference in our lives, that he is working on us, which by the means works through us to others. The Bible says they will see your good works and glorify your Father who is in heaven.
>> Caroline: Yes.
>> Bert Harper: Part of these good works is what we say. Part of these good works is what we think.
The Bible says forgiveness without forgiveness leads to bitterness and anger
I, want to come back to the grieving part in verse 30. But first I want to go on with this list. That he doesn't stop after he talks about grieving the Holy Spirit, he continues how we can grieve the Holy Spirit. Bitterness, wrath, anger, clamor, evil speaking, put away from you. Put them away. That's what I was talking about. He said, put off the old man. Put on the new man. Then he says, put away lying. And now he says, put these things away with all malice. Now, bitterness and anger, they go together. Anger unchecked, without forgiveness leads to bitterness. It really leads. Does. And have you heard this? Bitterness is like drinking an acid that, you know, destroys the container. It also said bitterness is like drinking poison, expecting someone else to die. I want to ask you this, Dylan, and come out straight with it. If we, when we've been wronged and we don't forgive, who. Who suffers?
>> Alex McFarland: I think you set me up there. It's very clearly, the person who holds the grudge, the person who seeks revenge. And that's one thing you learn very quickly in life, is that if you're a person who tends to hold a grudge, who wants to have vengeance against someone, you're the one who suffers from it. The other person could go on with their life and completely forget what had happened and you're back there still upset about it and letting it bother your day to day life. God is very clear to leave room for God's wrath. He will repay, he will be the judge of all wrong and a perfect way better than we can ever perform judgment on someone else. So it's better for us to forgive, as it talks about in this final verse, verse 32, forgiving one another and why it says, even as God in Christ forgave you, that's a pretty powerful example. We want to forgive others the way we want to forgive them, not the way that Christ forgave us, but when we're talking about the way Christ forgave us, it's without holding back, you know, it's complete, it's total, it's as far as the east is from the west. The Bible talks about, our sin is completely gone. And in the same way we're to completely forgive others, not bringing it back up later, not holding it against them, not slandering them behind the scenes later on, but moving forward in the power of God, forgiving them as God in Christ forgave us. That's such a powerful statement.
Let's look at these two things and I want you to respond to salvation and forgiveness
>> Bert Harper: Let's look at these two things and I want you to respond to salvation and forgiveness. Okay? Salvation is an event that is followed by a process. Okay. It really is, you know, it is an event, but there's more to it than that. it's great stuff afterwards. Forgiveness many times is more than an event. It has to be okay, because our minds, we will drag it up and we have to do what? Do it, go through it again. So there's people who are listening today, Dylan, that you don't know what they did to me. You don't know what happened. Yes, I understand that, I know that. And you say, well I've tried it for years and I, here's what I want to tell you. If you're struggling and you're struggling and trying to forgive them, but there's a tendency for you to hold on to it, don't give up, keep on and, and listen. The struggle of the journey is worth, outcome isn't, is.
>> Alex McFarland: And it's different for each of us. Some of us are very good at forgiving and moving forward. For others that bitterness is hard to let go of, especially if we've been deeply hurt or wounded or abused or bad's happened to us in the past. But it's a calling that we have as a Christian on a day to day basis to walk in his Spirit and to move forward and not to keep focusing what on what is behind us so that it keeps us held back from the progress God wants in our lives. it's also important, like you said, that we don't just focus on forgiveness, but we focus on growing in our salvation. You said salvation is a one time thing. We're saved one time, it's for eternity. But at the same time it's a daily process of sanctification. So there's salvation when our heart is changed by God, there's sanctification, that daily process of being made holy until we get to be with the Lord and be made perfect with him forever. So, it is a daily battle, it's a daily grind like they talk about when it comes to our work. But we are not without resources, unlike the person who lives without the Lord trying to do things in their own strength in life. We have God's spirit to empower us. He will get us through. We have the guidance and wisdom of scripture that we're going through right here. And you can pick up on your own at any time. So we have all the resources available, we have other people of God around us. So we have everything we need to do the good works God has called us to, like Ephesians talks about over and over is one of its major themes.
>> Bert Harper: It is, let's go back if we could. We've got maybe four minutes or something like that left and I really. Verse 30 is a powerful verse. it's the centerpiece of all this putting on and putting off what's in the middle, the relationship, our, Holy Spirit, God's Holy Spirit. Do not grieve the Holy Spirit of God, by whom you were sealed for the day of redemption. Yes, he comes in for the believer. Once we experience this salvation where Jesus Christ makes this amazing transaction to bring life into our life, light into our life, joy, peace, all that. Notice it is the indwelling power of the Holy Spirit. The Holy Spirit comes and lives. That's why Jesus said, it is necessary that I go away. Because when I go away, I'm going to send the Holy Spirit and he is going to lead you. And the day of Pentecost, when the Holy Spirit fell in power and the church was birthed, everything changed. Jesus, wasn't just in, Jesus was still in one location at the right hand of the Father. But the Holy Spirit, he could be in each believer. And when you look at all where the twelve apostles all went, they went to India, they went to Africa, they, you know, they went up north. The holy same Holy Spirit was each one of them. But then if we're not careful, according to First Thessalonians, we can quench the spirit. That quench means put the fire out. If you ever heard quench a fire. So you don't want to quench that when God has started this work and fired you up. you know, don't let people throw the water. Don't let people what people say, oh, you, you, you, you'll settle down after from camp. Oh, you had this experience at camp. So don't, don't, don't take it with you. Don't take it too serious. Don't let people quench the spirit. And then this one. Do not grieve the Holy Spirit. Do not let this irritation grieve the Holy Spirit. We need to be indwelt, but we don't need to quench or grieve the Holy Spirit, do we? Dylan?
>> Alex McFarland: You're right. And this chapter is so powerful because it has a bookend on each side where the end of it's talking about not grieving the Spirit, and the beginning of it's talking about the contrast, living a life worthy of the calling you have received. So how do we live a life worthy of the calling we have received? Well, we don't grieve the Spirit. We live by the Spirit so that we can be in harmony with the things of God, so we can move forward by the God's truth and change the lives of those around us and avoid some of these things that are listed right here by the Apostle Paul. it's a pretty detailed list. He doesn't leave it vague for us. Or you go, I wonder what he's talking about. He's very clear about malice and vengeance and slander and brawling and more. So, he's very clear on the things that we're to avoid as believers. And our calling is to live above the ways of our world and to stand out so that we can be salt and light to those around us. I'm looking so forward to after our break where we get a chance to talk with someone who's living out a very powerful example of what it means to be salt and light in our world in a special way. I don't want to give away all the information up front, but I do want people to stay with us because this is a very unique opportunity to hear from someone that, I'm very fascinated to know more about. As I've heard the story and I think the Listeners on today's show will be excited to hear more about it as well.
>> Bert Harper: Amen. We heard about this yesterday. Jason called in to let us know and I've asked Jason to call in. So, Jason, if you hear me, start dialing and we're going to put you on and we're going to update people on what God is doing in a little, town in south Mississippi of all places. And we're going to find out all that God has done and how he's working. And, I think this is going to be a unique opportunity that might really gravitate and build and let God's, you know, word go forth. So thank you for listening. And we'll be back with more that number 888-589-8840. America's 250th birthday. It's a great excuse to have some extra cake and ice cream, but we can help your celebration go well beyond that. Show your patriotism with America. 250 apparel that will become a memento of this special year. We also have special episodes on afa, stream to help underscore that America is a Christian nation and help you find God in the Constitution. Find all of this and more in one place. Afa.net topics250
>> Alex McFarland: from the highest of heights to the depths of the se. Creations revealing your majesty. From the colors of fall to the fragrance of spring. Every creature unique in the song that it seem.
Dylan Burroughs and Bird Harper discuss Ephesians chapter four
Welcome back to Exploring the Worst. This is Dylan Burroughs here with Bird Harper and we are glad to have you here with us today as we continue our fascinating discussion on Ephesians chapter four. And we have a special guest for everyone here in a moment. But before we do, I want to remind our listeners about AFA at the Ark. Have you heard about this? It's October 29th and 30th, so it may sound like it's far away, but it will be here before you know it. It's going to be at the Ark in Hebron, Kentucky and we invite you to join AFA Vice President Tony Vitagliano, Walker Wildmon and Wesley Wildmon for an exciting trip to Answers in Genesis, Creation Museum and Ark Encounter. This is a limited space event for you and your family to have special fellowship with some of our staff. The world renowned Ark, it's going to be part of seeing the Creation Museum. We're going to experience the botanical gardens. You'll see the dinosaur bones, fossils, the zoo and much more. All while being reminded of the greatness and sovereignty of our Creator Just like the song that we heard, starting our segment today. So you don't want to miss it. You can go to afa.net and it's under the section of events, afa.net events where you can register and get all the information about it. So wanted to make sure you are aware and can join us for that.
Bert: Jason from Mississippi calls in with prayer request for pastor
but, Bert, we have a special guest today. I want you to tell us the story and remind those who weren't with us yesterday what this is all about. It's a really special opportunity.
>> Bert Harper: It was yesterday. Jason from Laurel, Mississippi, called in. We were just. We didn't know he had on the line. It said, pray for my pastor. And I thought, well, I wonder what that's about. But when Jason shared this with us, everybody in the whole room lit up. They said, oh, wow, this is something. So, Jason, thank you for calling back, brother.
>> Caroline: Well, thank you for having me, gentlemen. I appreciate it.
Matt Olson of Mississippi church has been preaching for 93 hours on Facebook
>> Bert Harper: Okay, we want you to retell the story, a little bit of why your pastor, Matt Olson, pastor of the First Baptist Church Sharon, near Laurel, Mississippi, and tell the story about what he went through, what he decided to do, and what he's doing right now. Jason, go right ahead.
>> Caroline: Well, it all started last August. Brother Matt, had to go through some training. He trains missionaries in light survival training. And for 90, six hours, he was out in the wilderness and had been through quite a bit. and he got the idea. He says, I wonder what it would be like to preach for 96 hours. So that is how this whole thing has started.
>> Bert Harper: Okay. And he did some research, and he couldn't find it in the Guinness Book of Records, could he?
>> Caroline: he. They don't have the longest sermon, but they have the longest marathon speech. And it is by a Muslim in Dubai who spoke on the Quran for just a little over 80 hours. And at the end of 80 hours, the. The Muslim said that he. He had nothing else to speak about, that he had covered it all.
>> Bert Harper: Okay,
>> Caroline: so.
>> Bert Harper: Okay, so anyway, your Pastor Matt decided to do something about that. Is that right?
>> Caroline: Hey, D. And he said, why should that Muslim have that title? Let's see if we can. I'm gonna go for 96 anyway, regardless. He says, why don't I see if I can, claim that title for Christendom? So that's what he's. He is. He endeavored to do so if Guinness, you know, sees everything and everything meets their, specifications, he. Right now he has started his 93rd hour, I believe, of preaching. He has just started revelation.
>> Bert Harper: Oh, wow. 93 hours and preach it. And so he's still going, is that right?
>> Caroline: He's still going. He should finish about 6:30 tonight.
>> Bert Harper: Okay. And I hear, I talked to the church secretary today along with you and found out there's going to be a great, great celebration there at First Baptist Church. Sharon said, we're going to have the choir. I don't know if Brother Matt will want to be preaching. Dylan,
>> Caroline: It's going to be great.
>> Bert Harper: So if you want to go to church and not hear a sermon, this your time first and so tell a story. Jason, last night about midnight, I heard he was rejuvenated. You remember telling me that. Could you update our listeners on this?
>> Caroline: Yes. Last night when we were there, he, it was, it was really rough. He went through a really rough spell. a couple of our deacons and helped hold him up, the preach. and anyway he, through the sermon he started getting stronger and he sort of rallied and regained his strength. And last night about midnight he stopped and he asked, he says, I want to make sure something. I want to make sure that I'm still, you know, making sense. And what I am saying is biblical because if it's not, I want will stop. he says, I thought I had preached two hours, but I looked at the clock and I have been preaching for four hours.
>> Bert Harper: Okay, so, well, I just gotta say this. Jason and Dylan, our crew that's behind the window there, Marty and Richard, they, they came up with a man something. He said the Congress, they said the congregation is still waiting to go to lunch.
>> Alex McFarland: Yeah. You think your church's pastor has gone long on Sunday? Okay, just look, you know. Oh my goodness. Hey, I have to, do I have to jump in here though? for people who are interested in knowing more, you can go to the church's website. It's FBC Sharon S H A R O N Church. FBC Sharon Church. Or look them up on Facebook. They are live streaming right now. It has about 200 or so people who are watching. 2 to 300 people watching live right now as they get down to about the last three hours. He's planning to go until 6:30pm Central Time, 7:30 Eastern. So we got just a little bit more time left. But if you want to catch this live before it's completed, now is your chance. He's already passed the record that was mentioned before, I think 80 or 81 hours. So he's way past it and hopefully going all the way to 96 hours. So if you want to check that out, FBC Sharon Church or FBC Sharon on Facebook and check out the livestream of that. What a fascinating story, Bird. I can hardly believe it.
>> Bert Harper: Well, Jason, we want to thank you for calling in yesterday. We've been, there have been a lot of folks here. The news departments got ahold of the story and we shared it with them and with others and we're excited. God uses things like this to start a movement. He really does. And listen, if this is what we're praying and that's what we're going to do, we're going to pray that God would, yes, use Matt to continue, but this would be the, the beginning of a groundswell of the word of God being powerful and people listening and obeying. So we're going to do that. By the way, if you got a Bible question or a comment or prayer request, we'd love to hear it today. That number is 888-589-8840. But before we pray, I, I look at Kristin in Indiana and I think she's got a prayer request concerning the folks in Laura. So, so let's listen to that, Dylan. And after she gets through, we'll pray for the church and for the pastor and, and for what God can do with this Kristin in Indiana. Kristin, thank you for calling. Go right ahead.
>> Caroline: Thank you for taking my call.
A caller calls in to ask for prayer for Laurel, Mississippi following hotel fire
there is a godly group of people down there in Laurel, Mississippi. They call themselves the Framily. And they are renovating town of Laurel house by house, building by building. And last night my husband and I watched Hometown. the show is called Hometown. And they have been renovating a building into the Heirloom hotel. And it's beautiful. And unfortunately in August, there was an electrical fire and it burnt. And I ugly cried last night, let me tell you. And I just, just all day it's been weighing on my heart to pray for the people Laurel, Mississippi. And here now you have a pastor from Laurel. And I think it's God telling us we need to pray. We need to pray for Laurel. We need to pray for the Napier and their, their family, their friend family, the Raspberries. we need to pray. They're doing great work down there and spreading God's word and I'd love us to. Would you please pray for, for the town of Laurel?
>> Bert Harper: We are, we're going to. And we're praying that God would use this. Dylan, keep in mind, I'm asking you to pray. But if you got a question or a prayer request again, 885-89-8840. But most folks did not know they were in the middle of a revival or great awakening until it was over. You know, it just started something and you know, prayer, I, I'll use Jeremiah Lanfear in NewSong York City and him meeting together. Let's pray. You know, two people, four people, six people. But it wound up going across all over the northern tier of the United States in the great reprayer revival of 1850. So we're man, wouldn't it be great for it to start there? Let's Dylan Zara, pray for that and pray for brother Matt that he had finished strong on.
>> Alex McFarland: Yes, let's pray. God, thank you so much for this caller, calling in to pray about this situation with the hotel fire and praying for the people of Laurel and just thank you God that you're uniting believers despite the tragic situations. And we do pray for the recovery of this place. We pray that you would make them even stronger than before the fire and help it to be something that brings glory and honor to you and that many lives are changed through this process. And we continue to pray for this pastor who's lifting up your word for 96 hours and just help him to finish strong. And then it would be a story that would be told around the world of the greatness of our God and the greatness of your word and how much people love you and your word and proclaiming it to the ends of the earth. And Father, we lift this up to you and pray this in Jesus name. Amen.
>> Bert Harper: Amen. Thank you, Dylan. And we are praying. And Jason, thank you for calling in. And I got to give a shout out. He was telling me that his mother listens every day livestream, concerning exploring the word and we're her Bible study every day. Her name is Bobby. And Bobby, we, we thank you for praying for us. We really appreciate that so much. And Jason, thank you, Kristin. Thank you.
Charles says pastors ought to have secondary job
Let's go to Georgia and talk to. Is it the Charles?
>> Caroline: Yes, it's Charles.
>> Bert Harper: Okay. Okay, Doing good. Go right ahead, brother.
>> Caroline: All right. I, I teach Sunday school with a, rotation throughout with in our church. It's, it's not a big church, maybe 100, 120 members, something like that. But we have an old, older fellow there that says actually he's younger than I am because I'll be 84 here shortly. But anyway, he, he just contends that the pastors ought to be paid or like in old times when you know, they would come and speak for the love of the Lord and they would, we would give them a chicken plus a meal or something like that. And that would be a sour. He just doesn't think a pastor ought, just a pastor. He thinks that they ought to have a secondary job. Now I don't totally agree, but I know that there are some pastors who for the love of the Lord do come and speak and may or may not expect anything. But there are some pastors of larger or larger churches and ours is growing that they need. That's their kind of their full time job and that's what they want to do. But I don't really have a good comeback for him other than to say, you know, we don't live many years ago, this is a newer age and things have changed. But do you have any suggestions or thoughts or. I realize that Jesus said a workers is, you know, needs his wages. Okay, I think that was back in. Was that Luke?
>> Bert Harper: Yeah, it was. And don't muzzle the ox also, you know, don't do that. Let me tell you this. Ask him how he got got when he was working, how did he get paid and is he on retirement? Ask him if they're sending. I'm being little critical here. I am, I'm pastor, so I do, I, I rise up on this one. I try and do it with some humor. But ask him, do you want to be paid every month with chickens and, and some stuff or do you expect the money in the bank? Dylan, what would you say to Charles to help him here? Better than me. Better than what my sarcasm was.
>>Dillon: Yes, it's easy to get emotionally charged about this, but if you look at the Bible, it's very clear. It teaches the worker deserves his wages. The Apostle Paul connected that with Old Testament teachings about the Levites being provided for. So there is a biblical precedent for paying ministers who do the work of the Lord. Nothing wrong with that. Even though every situation is different. Even though throughout history most pastors have been bivocational where they've had another source of income as well. But first Timothy 5, 17 even goes beyond that and talks about giving double honor to church leaders who shepherd and preach well. And, and that's the idea of paying even more to somebody who's really good at their work, which we would do in any other field. Right. If you're the best in your field, you would get paid more than the average person. And the same principle applies in ministry. So there's nothing against it, but each situation should be looked at individually instead of some blanket statement that covers everything. But, there's certainly a biblical example for providing for the needs of those who serve your church family.
>> Bert Harper: If you want something else. The church at Philippi, they paid Paul while he was preaching to other churches. Okay. They really did. And others helped him. So, we got Tammy. We're going to pray for the upcoming vacation Bible school there. She's from Ohio. And Brent, you had something as well. Yeah, really quick, Carolyn, on, Facebook, she sent this to me. She said, I've been a born again Christian since I was 16, read and studied the Bible through various church small groups, but have never studied the Bible formally. I. I'm now 60 years old, and I was hoping you could recommend an online study forum that you know, would be theologically accurate. Okay. Dillon, you smiled big on that one. You got something on top of your head.
>> Alex McFarland: Well, I'm thinking come here every day, right? You know, four east and three Central. You get that every day of the week. but there's so many good things online. I mean, a place I go to a lot for Bible questions and answers is gotquestions.org has thousands of Bible questions and answers. If you want a resource to go through the Bible, you can go to somewhere like Bible.org which is a lot of the content from my professors from when I went to Dallas Seminary in a free format at Bible.org, the makers of the Net Bible. So tons of free content out there, but a lot of times it's finding something you can trust. And those are a couple. If you need more, just message us and we'll send you some other resources. But, that would be a great starting point.
>> Bert Harper: Tammy. I, know, I did not get you online, but we're for you. And we're praying for a lot of vacation Bible schools that's going on right now. So be praying for that. These youth camps, children's camps, vacation Bible schools, summer, mission trips. Wow. God is working, and he wants to work in your life. Dylan, thank you for being with us, brother.
>>Dillon: Great to be with you as always, Bert. Thanks everyone.
>> Bert Harper: And we'll be back tomorrow. We'll start in Ephesians, chapter 5, where it says, therefore. again, certain things you want to do after you've been saved, you need to grow in the Lord. We'll be back tomorrow with more.
>> Caroline: The views and opinions expressed in this
>> : broadcast may not necessarily reflect those of the American Family association or American Family Radio.
