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>> Jeff Chamblee: The Bible. It's the word of God. Sharper than any two edged sword. This sacred book is living and active and contains all that's needed for life and godliness. Stay with American Family Radio for the next hour as we study God's word and take your Bible questions.

Alex McFarland and Bert Harper discuss the book of Ephesians

Welcome to Exploring the Word.

>> Alex McFarland: In the dispensation of the fulness of the times, He, God, might gather together in one all things in Christ, both which are in heaven and which are on earth in him. Well, that's Ephesians, chapter one, verse ten. And we welcome you to today's edition of Exploring the word. Alex McFarland here along with Bert Harper. And we invite you to get a copy of God's Word and turn to the book of Ephesians. Now I'll ask you all the question I ask when I'm on the road. I'll always, if I announce the book that I'm preaching from, I'll say, is that Old or NewSong Testament? So Ephesians, is that Old Testament or NewSong Testament? Good answer, people. It's the NewSong Testament. And Bert, I love this book. It's not a long book, it's rather brief. But, as long as I've been a believer, Bert, I have loved the book of Ephesians.

>> Bert Harper: Well, there's reasons behind that love, Alex, because it's just packed full of great truths. Now I was looking at it as a whole and that's what I try to do. I read a book and then I do my best. Okay, what's this? Is it divided into sections? And there is the first part. We went over this yesterday. The first three chapters is our position in Christ and then the last, three is our practice. Now there's words that occur in the first three chapters that are amazing. And it's the word riches. So if you see the word riches, it kind of grabs your attention, Alex. The riches of his grace, the riches of his glory, the riches of his mercy again and again. And then in the last three chapters, there's a word that I looked that carries that theme and it's walk, walk worthy, don't walk no longer. Walk as the Gentiles walk, walk in love, walk as in the light, and then walk circumspectly. So when you see that in the book of Ephesians, who we are in Christ and how we're to respond in Christ, I think it deserves what you just said concerning it really gets our attention. And it has great promises and procedures, doesn't it?

>> Alex McFarland: Well, it really does. It really does.

Alex: I think it's important to look at the word dispensation

And you know, I've pondered, on verse 10 quite a bit and we started yesterday. So we're brand new in this study, if you're just tuning in folks. So, you know, you haven't really missed a lot yet. But you know, talking about in Jesus, we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of sins according to the riches of his grace. Verse 7. And by the way, if you're trusting in anything other than that, you really don't have biblical salvation. It is only through Jesus and what he did on the cross of Calvary for us. but in Jesus, oh my goodness, we have forgiveness of sins and the riches of his grace. Praise God. And he is, as, has been said, he is reconciling all things to himself and the word dispensation or administration or management. Let's talk about this a little bit, Bert, because, sometimes people have been taught that, the word dispensation is not biblical. And it really is. I mean, everybody at least believes in two dispensations. Old covenant, new covenant. I mean the Old Testament saints in faith, they look to the Messiah that would come. Now we look back at the Messiah that did come. Same Jesus, the Savior. We just live on two different sides of the cross. But Bert, famous, people, I think about, Charles Ryrie, who was a great scholar, I think about Dallas Theological Seminary, which is a great institution. You know, you know, in general, the word dispensation, by the way, in the Greek it's the word, oikonomi, or economy or arrangement or administration. They talk about innocence, which is, you know, Adam and Eve before the fall, then conscience from the fall to the flood, then the dispensation under the covenant of Noah, human government and then the dispensation of promise from Abraham to Moses, then law from Moses to Christ, and then grace. and we are often, you know, they'll talk about the church age. And we are in the age of grace, which is really, you know, from the Book of Acts to the present time, there is going to be the kingdom age. When Christ returns, there will be a thousand year millennium and then new heavens and new earth. But, I think it's important to look at, the word dispensation. And I'll say this, I'll throw it back to you. Part of the church age includes, for all believers, this assignment called the Great Commission. and so that's if you're a born again believer. We all have a part to play in the Great Commission and part of that is being in a church and then doing what we can do to help further the gospel around the world. But, God is a very orderly God and very structured and orderly in the way he deals with the human race. would you agree?

>> Bert Harper: I, agree fully. Let me give you a visual. You do this really well. Let me see if this one fits. It has its limitations, but I think it's good. If you were working in an office now, they didn't have a water fountain, but they had what they call a water cooler where they had a dispenser. And over it, it would say water. It could say water. But guess what comes along with that big, maybe five gallons, two gallons of water that's holding. It's upside down is a cup dispenser. Now, when you look at the whole thing, it's water, but that's what you're getting. You get water. When you look at God and you see how he works, you see grace, you see faith. Abraham, It's a matter of faith. Abraham, Moses, David. Faith. They had faith in the Lord. But as each person comes up to that water, dispenser, they get their own cup to get their own out. So God operated in that way. Yes. It's overall. And I think that if people could see it that way, they wouldn't say, oh, okay. It's not like God changes. No, it's the same water, but it comes out to a different person in that cup. They may get a half a cup, they may get a full cup, but it comes out that way. Alex, that helped me, understand dispensation along with, you're saved by grace through faith all the way from the beginning to the very end. And, so I agree with you. This is God operating. And let. One more thing. He's revealing himself in each one of those dispensations. I think. I think the book of Hebrews, chapter one, speaks that well. He has spoken to us in the past. Go and look for the prophets, from the law to the angels. But he has spoken to us in these last days through his son, Jesus Christ. That is a form of what you would call dispensation. In other words, God revealing himself. Would you, expand on that, if you would?

>> Alex McFarland: Yeah. And you know, what a glorious reality that God has revealed himself to the human race. Francis Schaeffer was a great theologian and, frankly, apologist, a, defender of the faith. And he wrote a book called the God who is There. I don't know if you remember that book.

>> Bert Harper: I do.

>> Alex McFarland: And, you know, well, let me read on. In the dispensation of the fullness of times. And that phraseology is in Galatians 4. 4, that God sent forth His Son in the fullness of time. God always does things at just the right time. and it says in verse 11, in him, in Jesus we have obtained an inheritance being predestined according to the purpose of him who works all things according to the counsel of his will, that we who first trusted in Christ should be to the prai of his glory. Amen. In him you also trusted after you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation, in whom, also having believed, you were sealed with the Holy Spirit of promise. And we're going to see that phrase again in Ephesians, sealed.

Bert says assurance of your salvation comes as you trust what the Bible says

But, Bert, isn't this beautiful? The gospel of our salvation is the word of truth. Let me just say this. I'll throw it to you, Bert. Traveling around the country, which I just am so blessed to do, I meet a lot of people that are unsure of their salvation, and they worry. And people say, I've prayed the sinner's prayer so many times, and am I saved? And how do I have assurance of that? a lot of reasons. And I think assurance of your salvation comes as you really take God at His word and trust what the Bible says. But here is, this thing, the word of truth, which is the gospel. And we know God can't lie. And the good news is Christ paid it on the cross. We receive that gift by faith, and it is t r u th it's truth, isn't it, Bert? And so, folks, give yourself, if you've trusted Jesus, give yourself permission to rest in that, that you are secure in the one in whom you believed, the risen Son of God, Jesus.

Alex: According to his purpose, God wants you to be born again

>> Bert Harper: There's so many things in these verses, and again, we try not to pick out all of them. If we did, we wouldn't get very far in this study. But the one that really caught me in verse 11 is, according to the purpose of him, God's purpose. again, one of the greatest things that ever happened to me in my walk with Christ was understanding that he had purpose for me, purpose for living, purpose for everything that I might be what conformed to the image of his dear Son. It is his purpose for me to be saved, for you who are listening today to be saved. And then that his purpose is that we would be conformed. Now, how are we conformed to his image? By being transformed. You go back to Romans 12. How? By the renewing of Our mind. And when I see this, as he develops this, he works all things according to the counsel of his will. That we who first trusted in Christ should be to the praise of his glory. We are to his praise as we grow in him, he disciples us. And when we do that, Alex, listen, it goes to the praise of our God. And that's what we ultimately want to do. So, according to his purpose, God wants you, those of you who are listening, to be born again. He desires you to become born like Christ. Now, you'll never become Christ. You're not going to become God. But you become the child of God through Jesus Christ. Alex, again, his purposes are awesome, aren't they?

>> Alex McFarland: They really are. They really are. And you know, praise God that He says, whosoever will may come. You know, I've also talked to people who get kind of hung up on election. What if I'm one of the non elect? Well, you know, I love what Charles, Spurgeon, he said, the more people I witness to, the more people turn, out to have been elected.

>> Bert Harper: Amen.

>> Alex McFarland: And yeah, I hesitate to bring it up because I don't want anybody to get hung up on it, but here's the thing. God has his foreknowledge and God has His perfect will. Of course, verse 11 references that. Here's the thing. If you pray and put your faith in Jesus, good news, you're elected. You know, I mean, whosoever will may come. And whosoever calls on the name of the Lord will be saved. Romans 10:13. And so, just rest in that, Bert, if you, try to completely, comprehend all of salvation. Well, the finite human mind can't comprehend all of it. But I know he loves me. He died for me. He said if I would put my faith in Him, I would go to heaven. And, I think that, we just have to trust that, what we don't understand, you know, he does. And we can't understand it all.

>> Bert Harper: Amen. Listen, when I look at the whole, God loves me. He said, come unto me, and I will not do away. I will receive you unto myself. And you start trying to divide that up, oh, man. Where does that come? Where does it fit in? It fits in when we come to Christ. It really does. We'll be back right after this message.

The AFR app is a powerful tool, but it does have limitations

>>  : The AFR app is a powerful tool, but it does have limitations. You can't use it to change the oil in your vehicle or get rid of carpet stains.

>> Bert Harper: It won't walk.

>>  : The dog won't pick up the dry cleaning or take the kids to practice. But while you're doing those things, you can listen to your favorite AFR content through the app on your phone, smart device or Roku. Just go to your app store or visit afr.net Listen to AFR Wherever you go with the AFR

>> Bert Harper: app,

>> Dr. Jessica Peck: I wish I could tell you. Wish I could describe it, but I can contain it. Can't keep it to myself. There are enough colors to paint the whole picture, not enough words to ever say what I found wonderful and beautiful and glorious and holy. He is merciful and powerful. Who we talking about? That's my King.

>> Bert Harper: Amen. It's the Lord Jesus Christ, the King of Kings, the Lord, Lord of Lords. And we pray that you do know Him. We really do. That's. That's honestly the main purpose of exploring the Word is that people come to know Jesus Christ as Savior and they can grow in him. Well, those of you that have been blessed by exploring the Word and other programming on afr, we want to hear from you. we're going to have Share a thon coming up in April. And during that time we play what we call the listener stories. And all you have to do is make a 1 minute, 2 minute phone call and tell what God has done for you by listening to afr. it's an encouragement to those of us who work here, but it's also an encouragement for those that are listening and say, well, man, I need to, I need to be a part of the family, not only listening, not only praying, but giving. And so we're praying that you would consider doing that. Write down this number and then you pray about it. Start practicing, writing out, one minute, two minute testimony of what God has done for you by listening to afr. Because we want to hear what God has done. Not necessarily what exploring the Word has done, not what AFR has done, but what God has done in your life for his glory. Using AFR. Now, here's the number. Get ready to write it down. 87-7-876-8893. I'll repeat it. 878-7-876-889-3. We would love to hear your story about how Jesus has used AFR in your life, Alex. I love it when we do this and it's always a blessing to me to hear what God has done.

>> Alex McFarland: Well, you know, one of the things that I just love about this ministry and I just, every day, I promise you, every day I thank the Lord that 16 years ago I got to meet Tim Wildmon and Jim Stanley and got involved. The thing that I love about this ministry, everybody, we give God the glory, and we're just. I mean, like a kid at Christmas. Think about whether it's the broadcast or the magazine or the website, Christians, are getting strengthened. People are getting evangelized. The name of the Lord is being lifted up. And, It's a thrill, isn't it?

>> Bert Harper: It is. And, I'm privileged to be a part of it. And you're on the board now. I have been on the board and to look, to see what, you know, the board members, what a blessing they are, man. They're men of faith, businessmen, pastors from all walks of life, and they love the Lord and then they desire afr. So it's a joy to have the leaders we do, the board members that we have, the work associates that we have. And so we want you to be a part of that by listening, sharing, praying. And when Charathon comes around giving and I listen, get all in and let God use you. Well, Alex, go ahead, Alex, go ahead.

>> Alex McFarland: Well, and. And, you know, I'm very blessed on the road because I'm in a pulpit somewhere pretty much every weekend of the year, and people come up. Sometimes people drive hours and hours and just very emotional. They'll say, have no idea how listening to the programming on AFR changed my life. And we give God the glory for that. So those Testimonies Again, it's 877-876-8893 if you want to call. And just for, you know, a minute or a minute and a half, let's brag on Jesus how God is using afr in your life.

Verse 13 speaks about being sealed with the Holy Spirit of promise

Hey, I love verse 14. It speaks about, in verse 13, we are sealed with the Holy Spirit of promise. Now, verse 14, who. And know that the Holy Spirit is a person. The Holy Spirit is personal. It's not an it or a force. But the Holy Spirit, is the third member of the Trinity, the person of God's Holy Spirit, who is the guarantee of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession of. To the praise of his glory. Now, Bert, I mentioned yesterday, John MacArthur was famous for, you know, he. On Sunday morning, he spent a decade in the Book of John and, you know, spent like a year on one verse. And we don't belabor it like that, but we could preach a long, long time. On verses 13 and 14, let's talk about that indwelling Holy Spirit, the earnest or the down payment or the guarantee of our salvation until the Redemption of the purchased possession. Aren't you glad that you, if you're a believer, you are a purchased possession, bought with the most precious commodity in the universe, the blood of Jesus, indwelled, sealed by the Holy Spirit. We belong to him. Hallelujah.

>> Bert Harper: Amen. Alex, the words in verse 14, you're the one. That's the word. You study the word. That's great in English. I look at, let's see, the geographical, the historical, but all of it goes to his glory. But listen to these words guarantee you earnest inheritance, purchased possession. Everything about that says ownership.

>> Alex McFarland: Exactly.

>> Bert Harper: Am I off there, Alex?

>> Alex McFarland: Well, that's right. And by the way, the word there, ereban is the Greek word that is, ah, it means a pledge or a down payment. And this is, I think, a good illustration and again, assurance of your salvation. So let's say you're going to buy a piece of real estate. I know our producer Brent is talking about, you know, a real estate transaction. So you, you put a down payment, and that's your earnest money. And maybe the closing date is 30 days from now, but you're under contract and you're not going to walk away because it's a legal agreement.

>> Bert Harper: Is the word vested. Have you heard that word?

>> Alex McFarland: You have a vested interest.

>> Bert Harper: You do. Go ahead.

>> Alex McFarland: Yeah, well, and you know, it's like if you put money in a retirement account, they will say you have vested x amount of money in your account. That folks, that's how it is. And one of the ways that we know we're saved and it's not feelings and it's not, you know, emotions that are up and down is the promise of God's word. But I remember when I gave my life to Jesus, it was different. The way I could tell the Holy Spirit was, you know, I'd get under conviction if I did something was wrong. You know, when the Holy Spirit is speaking to you, and I think that is one of the many ways that we know we are now born again, is the way that the Spirit of God convicts us and guides us and leads us. And so, folks, that precious, indwelling Holy Spirit is part of the, the reality that we now belong to Christ our Savior.

>> Bert Harper: Alex, praise God for what he's done.

I want to notice a transition from chapter one, verses one through 14

I want to notice a transition from chapter one, verses one through 14 to verse 15. Now I'm going to use it and you just, listen for a moment. In verse three, it says, who has blessed us? Verse four, he chose us, predestined us. You catch the Word. Us. Us. all three. But then in verse 15, he uses the word therefore. And again, those of you that are new, you may not have heard this, but when you see the word therefore, you ask, what is it? Therefore, it's a transition word that says, okay, this has happened. Therefore, this is what I'm going to share with you, or this. So notice this after using us and what all that God has done with our riches to his glory. Therefore, I also, after I heard of your faith in the Lord Jesus and your love for all the saints, do not cease to give thanks for you making mention of you in my prayers. In other words, what he was saying in verses 1:14, this is the riches of Christ. This is what we have. And what he says in 15, I've heard you've responded to it, you know. Listen, he says, I heard of your faith, man. You have responded to that. You haven't just let it lay dormant. No, it has taken fruit. It has. That faith has grown. Therefore, your, love for all the saints do not cease to give thanks for you. This is what he's done. And, Alex, again, I love what Paul is saying. He said, listen, God has given you the foundation, laid the groundwork, and now you have built upon it where you're not just concerned about yourself and your salvation. You love all the saints, and you're trying to get as many in as you can in verse 17. Now throw it back to you. That the God of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of glory. There's that word again. Again and again, may give to you the spirit of wisdom and revelation and the knowledge of him. And you can keep on reading. In other words, I've heard of your faith. I'm, giving thanks for what God has done, but I want to just tell you there's even more in Christ. Do you catch what he's saying? Do you think that's.

>> Alex McFarland: It's wonderful. It is wonderful. And, you know, Paul says that he gives thanks. He prays for them unceasingly. And 1723, which concludes chapter one. I mean, it really. There's so much in here, but it needs to be taken as a whole. Allow me to read this.

>> Bert Harper: Yes.

>> Alex McFarland: That the God of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of glory, may give to you. Here's what Paul is praying for. The Ephesian Christians. The spirit of wisdom and revelation in the knowledge of him, the eyes of your understanding, being enlightened, that you may know what is the hope of his calling, what are the riches of the glory of his inheritance. In the saints? And what is the exceeding greatness of his power toward us who believe according to the working of his mighty power, which he worked in Christ when He raised him from the dead and seated him at his right hand in the heavenly places? Now, there's much more here. But, Bert, I think about all that we have in Jesus. I mean, we know we'll go to heaven when we die. We know that our guilt has been washed away, and we have the indwelling Holy Spirit. Praise God. But on this journey, the Christian life, walking with the Lord, growing in the Lord, okay? The spirit of wisdom, revelation, the knowledge of God, the eyes of understanding, being opened. And then verse 18, that we know that means certitude. we have this confidence, the hope of his calling.

Alex: God has a call on your life, and you matter to God

Folks, God has a call on your life. Now, we often talk about a call to the ministry. If you're a believer, the Lord has purpose for you. You've got a reason to live. You've got a reason to get up every morning and face the day with joy.

>> Dr. Jessica Peck: You.

>> Alex McFarland: You have the hope of his calling, the riches of his glory, the inheritance in the saints. And I guess, Bert, I was talking to a lady earlier today, and she is getting older, and, her husband has passed, and she was kind of depressed and things. But here's the beautiful thing I want to say to everybody listening. You matter to God. You do. God sees where you are in your journey. That's, Deuteronomy 2. 7. And you matter to God. And yeah, we have a home in heaven, but we've got the blessings of Christ, being with us right now, this minute. Isn't that just wonderful?

>> Bert Harper: It is. It is wonderful. It really is. And he's going to keep on describing that as he goes on in this great book. Notice this, Alex. Notice this. Verse 17. The God of our Lord Jesus Christ, Father of glory. Then he talks about that you may what? How the spirit of wisdom, revelation, the knowledge of him. It's all about Jesus. The eyes of your understanding, being enlightened. And it goes on. The hope of his calling, the riches of his glory, of his inheritance for you, his power in verse 19, his mighty power in verse 20. He worked in Christ. Here's what I'm, trying to get to. The bottom line, all these awesome descriptions of what we have in Christ. The more you get to know Christ, the more you follow him, the more you obey him. You will be able to look at the world and your circumstances through his eyes. Because notice what it starts out with. His wisdom and revelation and knowledge, understanding, listen, that comes through our relationship with Christ. You're not going to get it out there just on your own. You're not going to have it just. Okay, I'm going. No, you dig for it. You work at it. Your salvation, he's already provided. But work out your salvation. That which you have, you need to develop. And when I see all this, he has given us what we need in order to live in this world that we have. Alex, we don't need to wait on anything else we have. We need to develop what God's given us, don't we? We do.

>> Alex McFarland: We really do. And, this is wonderful. And, if it seems like we're emphasizing Jesus, it's because we are. You know, let me read on here. Jesus, okay? He is seated at the right hand of God the Father. And this is. That's a reference from Daniel 9. But it says, far above all principality and power and might and dominion, and every name that is named not only in this age, but also in that which is to come. And now verse 22 is going to quote Psalm 86 and Psalm 110. One, and he put all things under his feet and gave him to be head over all things to the church, which is his body, the fullness of him who fills all in all. And that's a little bit of a reference to verse, 10. And I know there's so much here, but Bert, let's hone in for a moment on verse 21, because let me say this. There are angels and demons. Fallen angels. Non fallen angels, Lucifer and the fallen angels. That's the devil and his minions. And I want you to know they are subject to Jesus. They. They cannot do more than God would allow because Christ is above all centers of power, and by the way, not only the angelic powers, but even earthly powers. And Bert, aren't you glad God and God alone is in control of this universe?

>> Bert Harper: It is Christ, and Christ alone. He is Lord. That number. If you have your Bible question, triple 858-98-8840. We would love to hear your question today.

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>> Alex McFarland: They do an ultrasound.

>> Bert Harper: And that's when everything changed.

>> Alex McFarland: Because when I saw my baby and when I heard her heartbeat, that was it.

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>> Alex McFarland: Amen. Soon, and very soon, we're going to see the king. Hey, here's the telephone number for Bible Questions. It's triple 858-98840. That's 888-589-8840. And friend, we have a line open for you. We would love to hear your Bible question. You know, Bert, sometimes I kind, of jokingly say, if you've ever wanted to raise your hand during a sermon, here's your chance. Bert Harper and I will do our best to give you a good biblical answer. So we welcome any and all questions. Triple 858-98840. One last thing. I'll throw it back to Bert. we love to get emails too, and people correspond via email word fr.net and might, take us a day or two, but we'll do our best to answer each and every email we

>> Bert Harper: do and we appreciate.

James from Kansas calls in with question about shepherd staff and rod

Well, we got people that's called in. Let's get to as many as we can. And the first place we're going to go, Kansas and talk to James. James, thank you for calling today.

>> Caroline: Thanks for taking my call. Alex and Bert, I want to tell you that I don't know about other people, but, I try to, schedule my afternoon if I can. I work out of my truck and, and, your time of getting into the word, answering questions. it's, it's obvious that both of you are Bible scholars and theologians and so many of us are really blessed. I know you hear that all the time, but I just got a, toot your you guys horn because I am so blessed to get to listen. So here's my question. I have, recited as many of us have, Psalm 23: hundreds of times, especially at night if I'm having trouble sleeping or getting to sleep. So, just recently, just a few days ago, I asked the Lord, I said, lord, show me a little better understanding about the rod and staff, spoken of in song four. And yesterday evening, I, I'm blessed to get to hear afr. American Radio Bot Radio Network, and, CSN out of Twin Falls, Idaho, in northeast Kansas. And so I was listening to CSN last night, and I don't know if it's okay to mention, the pastor's name was Jeff Wickwire with Turning Point Church. And he said something that I thought. I mean, I listen to Christian. Have been listening to Christian radio for 30 years. I'd never heard this before. He said that back then, in biblical times, the rod was a shorter stick that the shepherd could throw at a predator, a wolf, you know, bear, whatever, and actually hit the animal to ward them off to protect the sheep. He said, today we can speak the word of God to. You know, I'm going to use an air quote here to throw it at the enemy, as Jesus did when he was, you know, led into, you know, when he was, fasting in the desert. And Jesus, you know, answered the devil and said, it is written so the spoken word is to resist the devil so that he will flee from you. And. And then regarding the staff, he said, everyone know, I mean, anybody studied shepherds and sheep knows that the staff is for correct comfort, correction and guidance by giving a gentle tap on the. The butt of the sheep or, you know, to pull them back with the crook or the hook. And. And so a shepherd staff is for constant care and guidance. Guidance, he said. Today, in. In our world, the staff is God's Holy Spirit, which is given to guide us into all truth, as it says, you know, right there in Scripture. And that ties right back into. As I was reading it again with new insight, that ties right back into the first part of verse three, where it says, he guides me or leads me in paths of righteousness for his namesake. So I'd like to get your input on that. And then if it's okay, I got a quick prayer request after you respond.

James: I need prayer for my wife who is seeking divorce

>> Bert Harper: Okay, well, let's do this as quickly as we can. Not only is what you just said a lot of truth in it, it is also the armor of God. over when Paul says, put on the armor of God, Alex. And James, you know, there's the defensive, okay? And then the offensive. The offensive is the word of God. I would say the only thing I would add to, he was talking about speaking the word of God. The word of God also works with that staff too, Alex. You know what I mean? He guides us with his word. it's not only just that of the enemy, but it's also for our guidance and for our protection as well, isn't really is.

>> Alex McFarland: And I think what the caller said is very true. And I had read that. Did you ever see the book, a Shepherd looks at Psalm 23?

>> Bert Harper: Oh, yes.

>> Alex McFarland: You remember that?

>> Bert Harper: Yeah.

>> Alex McFarland: And, that book was just so enlightening to me early in my Christian life about how, not only is Jesus the shepherd such an apt, illustration, but we sheep too. but what was your question, sir? And by the way, thank you for the kind sentiments.

>> Bert Harper: Yeah. What's your prayer? What's your prayer request, James?

>> Caroline: I called in, about a week ago, and, Bert, you and Dylan were taking calls then. I am. I've been married, well, we'll be 25 years in August, and my wife is seeking a divorce.

>> Bert Harper: Oh, yeah, I remember that, James. Okay.

>> Caroline: And, now it. Now it's gone to, you know, receiving paperwork, and I'm. I'm, trying to find a good attorney to represent me. If you don't know your rights, you don't have any rights. So I would just ask that you and the prayer family, the intercessors that are. That listen to afr, would. Would lift up, you know, this marriage, in northeast Kansas, and. And that, God would still intervene, that it would not take place. But if it is, I need wisdom and my. I need a good attorney. And so that's my request.

>> Bert Harper: Alex.

Father, we pray for James that you would help him during this time

All right. If I pray before we go, Father, I thank you for James. I thank you for him hearing that about Psalm 23, and about how you, not only protect, but Father, you guide, you do all those. And the enemy, like that says, comes at us. And so we stand in your word, the, shield of faith, the helmet of salvation. We stand against that enemy, and we speak your word, because that's what we do. And we pray for James that you would help him during this time. I'm still praying for his wife, that, Father, she would, see, and look at what you want. And, Father, that she would turn to you. And I pray that James would continue walking with you, reveal him, an attorney that would guide him through that and help him in this legal battle, because it is legal. And we ask that our friends that listen are praying for James and lifting him up during this time. In Jesus name. Amen.

>> Alex McFarland: Amen.

Is there a Bible reference for the 144,000 being called evangelists

>> Bert Harper: let's go to Tennessee. Is it Marcena?

>> Caroline: Yeah, go right ahead.

>> Bert Harper: Marcena, you're on the radio.

>> Caroline: I do have a question, if you could answer it. Is there a Bible reference for the 144,000 being called evangelists?

>> Bert Harper: Okay, we'll answer. Alex, is that one of the questions in our book?

>> Alex McFarland: Well, it is in our book, the 144,000 mentioned in, Revelation, chapter seven, verse four. And, by the way, Bert and I did this book called 100 Bible Questions and Answers on Prophecy and the End Times. And, it's available at the AFA Resource Center. It's available in bookstores everywhere, too, across America. But Revelation 7:4 says, I heard the number of those who were sealed, 144,000 from all the tribes of Israel. And, this is during the tribulation period. And so, these end up getting, martyred by the Antichrist. And it does talk about their mission, by prophesying, they, Zechariah 12:10 speaks about those that, really, during this tribulation time, come to Christ. they have a mission to evangelize during the post rapture world, and they get martyred for that.

>> Bert Harper: Bert, it is Marcena. Hope that answers your question. Revelation 4. Right, Alex?

>> Alex McFarland: Revelation 7:4.

>> Bert Harper: 7:4.

>> Alex McFarland: But it's also in Revelation 14:4.

>> Bert Harper: Okay.

>> Alex McFarland: Because, it says they follow the Lamb wherever he goes. These have been redeemed from mankind as first fruits for God and the Lamb. And so they, are. They're evangelizing, during the tribulation and getting martyred for doing it.

>> Bert Harper: Amen. Let's go. Or stay in Tennessee. And it's Joe. Joe, thank you for calling exploring the Word today. Go right ahead.

>> Caroline: Yeah, I'll ask this question and get off. I never hear anybody explain the word glory. Glorify. Jesus had glory with the Father. is glory separate from love, obedience, honor, and his glory different in different languages? I never heard anybody explain how you glorify. is it a special. would you expound on that and I'll hang up?

>> Bert Harper: Thank you, Joe. I'm not sure we've had that question quite like that, but think of glory. Think of light. Joe, think of when, two things. Moses on the mount and, God passing by and, hiding his in the cleft of the rock and put his hand before him because of the light. Think of the glory coming down in the temple. Alex, glory and light have a. They're not, you know, together. But if you're going to have glory, you're going to have light, aren't you?

>> Alex McFarland: Well, yes. And do you know, I'm so glad the caller called, because, like in John 17:1, Jesus prayed, Father, the hour has come. Glorify your son. That your son also may glorify you. So listen to this. The word, the Greek word is doxa. Doxa. And we have a song. We sing the Doxology. And so doxa logos, the doxology. glory be to the Father. You know, we're giving glory. And the Hebrew word, by the way, is kabo, which means weight or heavy. Now, the Greek word doxa, and we translate glorify, but it really means splendor. Now, how do we glorify God? Well, for one thing, like the Hebrew word heaviness or gravity, we attribute to God the reverence and the gravity due his name. I'm not saying heaviness in terms of like, mass, like, boy, that's a heavy object. No, but, the gravity, the reality that God is our creator, God is our Savior, he sees all that we do, and to give him glory. I think it encompasses praise, it encompasses gratitude. But we're supposed to be grateful to God, aren't we? But, also, I think it's rejoicing. Yesterday you mentioned the catechism that we are to glorify God and in enjoy him forever. It's a joy to know the Lord.

>> Bert Harper: Amen.

>> Alex McFarland: it's a joy to belong to God, isn't it?

>> Bert Harper: It really is. Let me give you one more, and then we'll go to the next caller. the Bible says that they might see our good works. And do what? Glorify our fathers in heaven. Now, what do our good works do? I'm going back to my light. It casts lights. It shines the light. when there's a church program, and maybe it's a drama or it could be, just musical and somebody has a very important song, a very important line, what do they do? They put the spotlight on that person that is speaking. What we do with our lives and what we do with our words. We spotlight God, Alex. That's the glory. We glorify him. Spotlight. not us, but him. So, Joe, we hope that helps, brother.

Alex: I have a question about hell and the lake of fire

Let's go to Texas and talk to Candice. Candace, go right ahead.

>> Caroline: Hello from the great state of Texas.

>> Bert Harper: We'll agree with you.

>> Caroline: Yes, it is. I have a question about the lake of Fire. What happens in the lake of fire? Says the devil. Enjoy being there. Or.

>> Bert Harper: Okay, we'll. Yeah, we'll try to answer that, Candace. That's a good question, too, Alex. Hell was thrown into the lake of fire. I heard. You know you can. It wasn't a serious title, but the person said, hell, you won't be there forever. Okay, with that in mind, why he used that passage about hell being cast into the lake of fire. And if hell is bad, and we've had this debate, annihilation. Is it annihilation or is it continual, continual torment? I believe it's continual torment. Go ahead.

>> Alex McFarland: Yeah, because listen, Revelation 14:11 says of the unsaved, not only the lost humanity, but the beast and his image. It says the smoke of their torment, ascends forever and ever. I categorically reject annihilationism. I know some people have said that, well, maybe the devil and the lost, you know, people get punished for a while and then they're kind of snuffed out or something like that. and no, Satan is not going to enjoy it. the Bible says in Revelation 20, verse 15, whoever was not found written in the Lamb's book of life is cast into the lake of fire. And Bert, I'm not trying to be flippant here, but, this is God's, garbage dump. I mean, really.

>> Bert Harper: Hey, the word Gehenna that hell is referred to was the garbage dump of Jerusalem. Alex.

>> Alex McFarland: It really was. Matthew 10:28, Mark 9 and Luke 12. Jesus refers to Gehenna and he sort of uses the word gehenna and hell interchangeably. And it was outside the city. you know, Matthew 8 and 22 talk about outer darkness. And so when the Bible talks about hell and then the lake of fire as the ultimate destination of those that reject Jesus. And of course the devil and his angels, the beast, the false prophet. I have to say this. If you really read what the Bible says, it is terrifying. now, Bert, I'll say this. I thought about you. I had an evangelist say one time, if you come to Christ out of fear, that's the wrong motivation. I disagree. I think it's a rational motivation. We love Jesus, but hey, any, reasonable person, you don't want to go to hell and be lost, come to Jesus and be saved.

>> Bert Harper: I can testify to that. As a 12 year old boy, I knew about heaven. I heard a sermon on hell and I knew Jesus had a place better than that. So it was a combination of fear and love. Turning my heart toward christ as a 12 year old boy. Robert.

We'll be back tomorrow with more of exploring the word

Jerry, we'd love to have gotten to you today, but we had these four questions. We got them answered as best we can, but we'll be back tomorrow. We're going to be in Ephesians and we're going to say a little bit about the rest of chapter one. Then we're going to move on to chapter two. And I just want to tell you, it doesn't stop being awesome. So tune in tomorrow for more of exploring the word.

>> Alex McFarland: The views and opinions expressed in this

>> Bert Harper: broadcast may not necessarily reflect those of the American Family association or American Family Radio.

Christ Above All: Ephesians 1:11-23